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So Sniper, what do you make of news stories like this?


Take Hezbollah off list
MPs: Liberal, NDP politicians in Lebanon say terrorist label discourages negotiations

Matthew Fisher; with files from Melissa Leong, CanWest News Service; National Post
Published: Monday, August 21, 2006

BENT JBAIL, Lebanon - It would aid the cause of peace if Canada dropped Hezbollah from its list of banned terrorist organizations, two Canadian MPs on a fact-finding mission to Lebanon said yesterday.

When asked if he was in favour of Hezbollah being taken off the terror list, Etobicoke Liberal Borys Wrzesnewskyj said: "Yes, I would be."

He likened the situation in the Middle East to that of Northern Ireland, where "if there wasn't the possibility for London to negotiate with the IRA, you'd still have bombings."

"Hezbollah has a political wing. They have members of parliament. They have two Cabinet ministers. You want to encourage politicians in this military organization so that the centre of gravity shifts to them."

New Democrat Peggy Nash, who represents the Toronto riding of Parkdale-High Park, said her discussions in Lebanon had led her to believe "that it is just not helpful to label them a terrorist organization."

"If the political parties in Lebanon who may disagree with Hezbollah, and be opposed to them and their philosophy, can figure out a way to work with Hezbollah and try to get along internally, then perhaps we should take a cue from that."

Both MPs said they would bring that message back to their caucuses, and eventually to the House of Commons, when they return to Canada this week.

Full article here - http://www.canada.com/nationalpost/news ... 719a31&p=1

read this last week.... i think yes they should be taken off.........being in terrorist list doesnt do any help as it didnt for past 20 yrs.....it's centralised leader organisation and Nasarallah keeps his word as he did until now...


in reponse to that the tory government strongly denied accepting hezbollah and reiterated that he supports Zionism.....moron! I mean canada should b neutral country dont try to get into mess which doesnt even benefit you. Just trying to copy the great states.

This is what I mean, we have both the Liberals and NDP taking a more enlightened and productive view, but in the end we are saddled with the Conservatives in power who are so narrow-minded and who blindly support US policies.

It makes me feel better that we have some politicians on the ground investigating and pushing the government to follow a different course in action. Let's hope they can make a difference...

whatever be the case the last thing i want is us canadians to pay for blood spilled by Americans. It would be better for Canada to withdraw from NATO and bcome neutral country .Government is afraid of losing support of America which is crucial for running the country

Sniper, that isn't likely to happen. The US remains Canada's biggest trading partner. It would be a disaster for the Canadian economy to anger the US. It that foreign policy dialogue that many Candians contributed to, many people responded that they would like to find more trading partners and make more business in Europe, Asia and elsewhere, but still the US is the largest at this moment.

kanelli wrote:Sniper, that isn't likely to happen. The US remains Canada's biggest trading partner. It would be a disaster for the Canadian economy to anger the US. It that foreign policy dialogue that many Candians contributed to, many people responded that they would like to find more trading partners and make more business in Europe, Asia and elsewhere, but still the US is the largest at this moment.

i know....but we are digging our graves now Canada is going offensive in Afghanisthan

Yes, Canada will certainly become a target now.

As much as I look forward to Canadian troops leaving Afghanistan, I still think it is good that they are pushing to get all the Taliban out. I was speaking to a Canadian soldier operating in Afghanistan, and he told me that the villagers don't want their villages taken over and controlled by the Taliban. The soldiers get cooperation from the people for finding where the Taliban are hiding and what they have been up to in the area. This is hardly the picture of "yet another Western country coming in and oppressing Muslims" that many outsiders like to paint.

kanelli wrote:Yes, Canada will certainly become a target now.

As much as I look forward to Canadian troops leaving Afghanistan, I still think it is good that they are pushing to get all the Taliban out. I was speaking to a Canadian soldier operating in Afghanistan, and he told me that the villagers don't want their villages taken over and controlled by the Taliban. The soldiers get cooperation from the people for finding where the Taliban are hiding and what they have been up to in the area. This is hardly the picture of "yet another Western country coming in and oppressing Muslims" that many outsiders like to paint.

but u see those villagers are few. What Canadains can do is to get these taliban haters afghanis and train em instead of getting directly involved. it will b better cos 1,intelligence will be better in afghanis 2, they can make afghans independent. 3, they can reduce canadian casualties

Truthfully Sniper, neither of us are from Afghanistan (unless you are haven't mentioned it before). Do any of us really know what the general population thinks there? What I note is that the only people killing soldiers in Afghanistan are the Taliban, and any warlords who can't go about their crooked business when soldiers are present. The Afghan people are not rising up and trying to expel the Canadian or other forces there.

In my view, too many Afghan villagers would be killed, despite any training they would get from Canadian or other forces there. The Taliban are more experienced and they need to be fought with professional fighters in order to keep the casualties lower (Taliban casualties higher, of course.) The whole situation is complex, and I am not expert enough - so this is just my amateur opinion.

kanelli wrote:Truthfully Sniper, neither of us are from Afghanistan (unless you are haven't mentioned it before). Do any of us really know what the general population thinks there? What I note is that the only people killing soldiers in Afghanistan are the Taliban, and any warlords who can't go about their crooked business when soldiers are present. The Afghan people are not rising up and trying to expel the Canadian or other forces there.

In my view, too many Afghan villagers would be killed, despite any training they would get from Canadian or other forces there. The Taliban are more experienced and they need to be fought with professional fighters in order to keep the casualties lower (Taliban casualties higher, of course.) The whole situation is complex, and I am not expert enough - so this is just my amateur opinion.

ofcourse they kill any beard man with a gun they call them Taliban when infact warlords and their men do have beard and warlords were against talibans cos talibans asked them to stop growing poppy which is vry very profitable.

now poppy cultivation has gorwn up by 70% since the fall of Taliban..... those talibans werent even directly involved in Sept 11 most of the moeny came from Pakistan to Dubai and they wired to US. Osma is a fool and knows only to pull the trigger but Lo US needs a villan and he was OSAMA! liek wild wild west we also joined to hunt OSAMA like bounty hunter...

there is far worse than taliban and that is poppy which was started and funded by ISI in 70's to destroy West's younger genration and so far they have been succesful in doing so. If u want to make afghanithan a better place first destroy warlords and poppy and then we will find a way to destry taliban too.

I don't care if poppy production has increased - the fact remains that there is a market for it. If people didn't use the drug, then Afghans wouldn't be growing poppies.

The Taliban was very oppressive and that far outweighs the whole poppy production issue.

The Taliban is not the same thing as Al Qaeda - they merely supported Al Qaeda.

Canadian soldiers are not shooting every man with a beard - that would be pretty much every man in Afghanistan! Give me a break Sniper.

kanelli wrote:I don't care if poppy production has increased - the fact remains that there is a market for it. If people didn't use the drug, then Afghans wouldn't be growing poppies.

The Taliban was very oppressive and that far outweighs the whole poppy production issue.

The Taliban is not the same thing as Al Qaeda - they merely supported Al Qaeda.

Canadian soldiers are not shooting every man with a beard - that would be pretty much every man in Afghanistan! Give me a break Sniper.

hehhe u havent read the account of ow they gather intelligence did u? hehehe

u underestimate what poppy has done to the world......it has desertified afghanistan, less edible crops, warlords getting more money thus their own fiefdom......and for ur info warlords are FARRRR i repeat way more repressive than Talibans were. Taliban destroyed feudalism that's why they gained popularity so fast. One account a poor farmer was asking for water for his dying son but since he didnt pay his dues the warlord refused and the man kept bugging him the warlord shot him to death! these warlords rule afghanitan not the government...u can research for urself

Oh man, you seriously think that Afghanistan was better under the Taliban? I don't know what to say...

In my opinion they will have a brighter future now, despite the awkward stage of change in between trading one form of stability for another.

Kanelli,

I saw an interesting news report on the BBC which showed the growing popularity of the Taliban amongst ordinary Afghanis. The new government is ineffective and weak, and rife with corruption.

As pointed out also, poppy production is flourishing whereas it was effectively banned under the Taliban.

Don't get me wrong - I strongly denounce the oppressive policies of the Taliban (banning radio, tv - blowing up statues, curtailing women's rights etc), but just am reporting what was shown on the news reports.

It didn't strike me as if they were having a "Mussolini made the trains run on time" moment, ideolising the past - but were making genuine comparisons between the current chaos and lawlessness and the order that was there under the Taliban.

You have to remember that the Taliban came to power after defeating war-lords and politicians/military who hardly ruled by rule of war. This followed the defeat of the Russians and effective abandonment of Afghanistan by the West who hitherto had been training and arming the Mujhahideen (including one O.B. Laden).

I think also if you do a search on a post on the subject by Lionheart, he lays out many claims of disinformation about the Taliban disseminated by the Western intelligence communities and reported by the media. The

Taliban brought order from chaos and, in my opinion, went too far down the 'fundamentalist' route - but credit must be given for what they did right.

The problem is that the solution sought by the invasion of the country is in parts worse than the cure. Soldiers are being killed every day and large parts of the country aren't under the control of the government.

Sadly, one good thing you can say about Afghanistan is that the situation is not as bad as it is in Iraq right now!

Cheers,
Shafique