Do You Support Racial Profiling In Airports?

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Do you support racial profiling in airports? Aug 16, 2006
http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/europe/08 ... profiling/

This is what former Scotland Yard chief had to say
He wrote: "I'm a white 62-year-old 6ft 4in suit-wearing ex-cop -- I fly often, but do I really fit the profile of suicide bomber?

"Does the young mum with three tots? The gay couple, the rugby team, the middle-aged businessman? No. But they are all getting exactly the same amount and devouring huge resources for no logical reason whatsoever.

"Yet the truth is Islamic terrorism in the West has been universally carried out by young Muslim men, usually of ethnic appearance, almost always traveling alone or in very small groups.

"A tiny percentage, I bet, of those delayed today have such characteristics.

"Of course, there will be instant squealings that this is racism. It's not. It's exactly the same as recognizing that, during the Northern Ireland troubles that left thousands dead, the IRA were totally based in the Catholic community and the UVF in the Protestant."


Well he is ignoring the fact that some of thesuspects were Caucasians who recently converted. The terrorists can take advantage of this situationor loophole if they ever implement this. Secondly it will widen the gap between the community leaders who just blamed the government and the terrorists will sneer at moderates " Didnt I tell u guys you wont be accepted"

Instead in my opinion thye should randomly check ppl and increase collabration with Mulsim community to root out the causes of hatred and recruit members from the community to watch out for these kind of stuff.

sniper420
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Re: Do you support racial profiling in airports? Aug 16, 2006
sniper420 wrote:http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/europe/08/15/passenger.profiling/

This is what former Scotland Yard chief had to say
He wrote: "I'm a white 62-year-old 6ft 4in suit-wearing ex-cop -- I fly often, but do I really fit the profile of suicide bomber?

"Does the young mum with three tots? The gay couple, the rugby team, the middle-aged businessman? No. But they are all getting exactly the same amount and devouring huge resources for no logical reason whatsoever.

"Yet the truth is Islamic terrorism in the West has been universally carried out by young Muslim men, usually of ethnic appearance, almost always traveling alone or in very small groups.

"A tiny percentage, I bet, of those delayed today have such characteristics.

"Of course, there will be instant squealings that this is racism. It's not. It's exactly the same as recognizing that, during the Northern Ireland troubles that left thousands dead, the IRA were totally based in the Catholic community and the UVF in the Protestant."


Well he is ignoring the fact that some of thesuspects were Caucasians who recently converted. The terrorists can take advantage of this situationor loophole if they ever implement this. Secondly it will widen the gap bet ween the community leaders who just blamed the government and the terrorists will sneer at moderates " Didnt I tell u guys you wont be accepted?"

Instead in my opinion thye should randomly check ppl and increase collabration with Mulsim community to root out the causes of hatred and recruit members from the community to watch out for these kind of stuff.


Good posting Snipes, I support your opinion.
sage & onion
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Aug 16, 2006
You missed a few important points however, which were brought up in discussions about this on various news networks yesterday.

He said 'usually' ethnic looking, not 'always', they will pull over ANY young man travelling alone, no matter what his ethnic look is. Also people who pay for their airfare using cash only, as who does that? Very few people and it's indicative of people not wanting to leave a paper trail. Also they could be looking at mothers with babies or young children, they fear that many of those recruited for suicide bombing are such people who're willing to sacrifice themselves and their children - sick!

Completely random checks are a waste of time, why would you after all stop an 80 year old granny?

People will always say that these things are racist etc etc etc. However that's the price you pay when only certain members of society are making and willing to carry out threats, and it's also upto their own to weed out those that would do harm.

If it tightens security and acts as a deterrent then so be it.
Chocoholic
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Aug 16, 2006
Chocoholic wrote:You missed a few important points however, which were brought up in discussions about this on various news networks yesterday.

He said 'usually' ethnic looking, not 'always', they will pull over ANY young man travelling alone, no matter what his ethnic look is. Also people who pay for their airfare using cash only, as who does that? Very few people and it's indicative of people not wanting to leave a paper trail. Also they could be looking at mothers with babies or young children, they fear that many of those recruited for suicide bombing are such people who're willing to sacrifice themselves and their children - sick!

Completely random checks are a waste of time, why would you after all stop an 80 year old granny?

by random i meant random ppl who fit the suspicious profile. And yeah 80 yr old granny can b used as mens to get in the stuffs....eg hding stuffs in the walking sticks can go undetected.
People will always say that these things are racist etc etc etc. However that's the price you pay when only certain members of society are making and willing to carry out threats, and it's also upto their own to weed out those that would do harm.

If it tightens security and acts as a deterrent then so be it.
sniper420
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Aug 16, 2006
This kind of profiling happens all the time in airports - they have a typical profile for people who might be smuggling drugs, or carrying food etc

I remember reading a post on here about people getting their containers checked when moving to dubai and someone was saying that they were asked two questions 1. Are you an Arab 2. are you Muslim ... and their container was cleared unopened.

Profiling is part of life as long as it is not possible/economical to check everyone.
ajb
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Aug 16, 2006
ajb, or you wait patiently with a nice smile. They never opened any of my stuff.

Going back on what I previously posted, one of the downsides and balancing acts that you have to do, is not to alienate those which could potentially help you catch the culprits or suspects. Quite how you go about that, I don't know.

But yeah you're right in saying they have certain steroptypes for different offences, when travelling back from Amsterdam you can always tell which people they're going to stop and search for drugs.
Chocoholic
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Aug 16, 2006
My opinion is that profiling not only borders on racism but is stupid.

Anyone clever and determined enough to pull off 9/11 will certainly be clever enough to realize that a certain "look" etc. will attract attention and be stopped for questioning. All this will do is shift the terrorist focus on recruting non "arab looking people" (if that is the profile). There are plenty of of nuts outhere that can be recruited and will by anyone determined to harm others.

I for one have no problem with security checks for 100% of the people and I travel quite often. If the rule is made permanent that all you can carry on board is your passport, some cash credit cars, kesy, medication and baby food (as necessary) then it should take a few minutes to clear security. Think about it what do you really need on the plane other than perhaps a book. If you need a computer I image in the future you could request a computer ahead of time and the airline can provide it for you (just like a special meal) all you would need to do is bring the data on a disk or whatever.
Concord
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Aug 16, 2006
They've already lifted the hand luggae ban!

I tell you what when I travelled to Malaysia, I went off on one at the airport security at how lax it was. My friend and I were travelling with backpacks which we don't check but take on as overhead luggage. And not once did we get body scanned or have our luggage screened until we got to the gate. It was shocking and appalling. Plus both arrivals and departures mix in the duty free hall, which is the businest part of the airport. I told them in no incertain terms that it would be so easy for a person to let off a device there and the carnage would be massive, as there were thousands of people there all at the same time - absolute morons!
Chocoholic
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Aug 16, 2006
Yes. They should be stripe searched, put into orange jump suits and handcuffed or better still send them by boat because they believe that to fly in an aeroplane is western decadence and aeroplanes are the work of our master Satan
chevaliers-de-sion
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Aug 16, 2006
Well now here's a crazy idea for you! Why don't they just re-outfit planes, so that passengers are placed in isolation pods and sedated for the duration of the flight. If people aren't conscious, they can't do anything can they, plus think of the cost cutting - less staff, no food or drinks required on board, no hassle with passengers etc etc etc.
Chocoholic
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Aug 16, 2006
Chocoholic wrote:They've already lifted the hand luggae ban!

I tell you what when I travelled to Malaysia, I went off on one at the airport security at how lax it was. My friend and I were travelling with backpacks which we don't check but take on as overhead luggage. And not once did we get body scanned or have our luggage screened until we got to the gate. It was shocking and appalling. Plus both arrivals and departures mix in the duty free hall, which is the businest part of the airport. I told them in no incertain terms that it would be so easy for a person to let off a device there and the carnage would be massive, as there were thousands of people there all at the same time - absolute morons!


I know of others similar situations not just at airports but prefer not to give anyone any "ideas"!
Concord
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Aug 16, 2006
A person who would do such a thing is not sound of mind IMHO.
Chocoholic
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Aug 16, 2006
Agreed.
Concord
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Aug 16, 2006
Chocoholic wrote:Well now here's a crazy idea for you! Why don't they just re-outfit planes, so that passengers are placed in isolation pods and sedated for the duration of the flight. If people aren't conscious, they can't do anything can they, plus think of the cost cutting - less staff, no food or drinks required on board, no hassle with passengers etc etc etc.



Chocs - have you watched Alien recently? :)
shafique
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Aug 16, 2006
nah..Chocs just seem to be tired of all insanity in this world. But for me, do whatever it takes just to make sure the trip would be safe. Stop pointing fingers or making unaccurate statements.... inspect everyone and everything. Ohh specially the cabin crew and the peeps who works in airport. I believe they are the weakest link in our era! Their luggage or whatever is not being inspected. They can enter and exit aircrafts w/ or w/o asking approval of anyone! :oops:
zam
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Aug 16, 2006
when i travel i usually pay cash for the ticket since i dont have a credit card. and i found it funny whenever i travel no matter what im wearing i always get a hard time (since sept 11), with one exception listed below. when i flew to cali with friends from they all got through fine but they asked me to step into the security room and started asking me all these questions. after that they said they wanted to search and i was like if you want me to strip you might as well send me to jail because thats not happening. he just looked at me and said i could continue on and to have a safe flight. what was i wearing...jeans and a t-shirt, no scarf, no aybaya, just plain jeans and a black t. same thing happened when we went to ny, mo, and florida. when i went to france and italy no one bothered me but when i came to uae i was wearing jeans and a shirt, they gave me a tough time (but that was because they thought i didnt know arabic and started saying how i became westernized and how horrible of a muslim i was since i wasnt wearing abaya and shelia. i looked them and in arabic said im palestinian, we dont wear abaya's and if i choose not to cover my hair thats my business.) when i left for qatar and returned to the uae i was wearing abaya and sheila and they didnt even ask me to go through security cuz there was a long line, they opened up a counter for me to stamp my passport and let me go home...i didnt have to wait at all...weird
bushra21
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Aug 16, 2006
bushra21 wrote:when i travel i usually pay cash for the ticket since i dont have a credit card. and i found it funny whenever i travel no matter what im wearing i always get a hard time (since sept 11), with one exception listed below. when i flew to cali with friends from they all got through fine but they asked me to step into the security room and started asking me all these questions. after that they said they wanted to search and i was like if you want me to strip you might as well send me to jail because thats not happening. he just looked at me and said i could continue on and to have a safe flight. what was i wearing...jeans and a t-shirt, no scarf, no aybaya, just plain jeans and a black t. same thing happened when we went to ny, mo, and florida. when i went to france and italy no one bothered me but when i came to uae i was wearing jeans and a shirt, they gave me a tough time (but that was because they thought i didnt know arabic and started saying how i became westernized and how horrible of a muslim i was since i wasnt wearing abaya and shelia. i looked them and in arabic said im palestinian, we dont wear abaya's and if i choose not to cover my hair thats my business.) when i left for qatar and returned to the uae i was wearing abaya and sheila and they didnt even ask me to go through security cuz there was a long line, they opened up a counter for me to stamp my passport and let me go home...i didnt have to wait at all...weird


That Qatar thing: not cool.
Concord
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Aug 16, 2006
Concord wrote:That Qatar thing: not cool.




lol i kno, worst experience of my life.........

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Aug 17, 2006
I think smart rather than racial profiling is an important way to catch anamolous behavior at any border point. Here is a great story of how a smart customs agent stopped a possible problem:

An England football shirt gave away a Senegalese man attempting to enter Cyprus on a forged French passport, police on the Mediterranean island said on Monday.

Suspicions were aroused when the man appeared at a checkpoint supervising crossings from the Turkish Cypriot north to the Greek Cypriot south of the divided island, wearing the England shirt and presenting a French passport.

"Being a football fan, the officer found it highly unlikely that a Frenchman would want to wear an England football jersey," a police source said.

"That was his first suspicion prior to the proper check on the passport, which turned out to be a fake," said the source.


this shows how smart behavioral-based profiling is much more effective than dumb characteristic/racial-based profiling, and how well-trained people are much better than computers.
MaaaD
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Aug 17, 2006
i agree, sure would speed things up a bit. but like in everything else in life, people want to take the easy way out -- pick on the small kid...or in this case, easy target.
bushra21
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Aug 17, 2006
repeat post - doh!
Chocoholic
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Aug 17, 2006
Not really an easy way out, and I'm pretty sure that people wanting to cause trouble would have done their homewark first. The point is if they're going to do it, it needs to be done with sensitivity and respect. But as far as I'm concerned anything which would stop a problem happening in the first place is worth it, many forget that point.

Security is still crap, a young boy without a passport or ticket nmade it onto a plane heading to Lisbon yesterday!
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Re: Do you support racial profiling in airports? Aug 17, 2006
sage & onion wrote:
sniper420 wrote:http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/europe/08/15/passenger.profiling/

This is what former Scotland Yard chief had to say
He wrote: "I'm a white 62-year-old 6ft 4in suit-wearing ex-cop -- I fly often, but do I really fit the profile of suicide bomber?

"Does the young mum with three tots? The gay couple, the rugby team, the middle-aged businessman? No. But they are all getting exactly the same amount and devouring huge resources for no logical reason whatsoever.

"Yet the truth is Islamic terrorism in the West has been universally carried out by young Muslim men, usually of ethnic appearance, almost always traveling alone or in very small groups.

"A tiny percentage, I bet, of those delayed today have such characteristics.

"Of course, there will be instant squealings that this is racism. It's not. It's exactly the same as recognizing that, during the Northern Ireland troubles that left thousands dead, the IRA were totally based in the Catholic community and the UVF in the Protestant."


Well he is ignoring the fact that some of thesuspects were Caucasians who recently converted. The terrorists can take advantage of this situationor loophole if they ever implement this. Secondly it will widen the gap bet ween the community leaders who just blamed the government and the terrorists will sneer at moderates " Didnt I tell u guys you wont be accepted?"

Instead in my opinion thye should randomly check ppl and increase collabration with Mulsim community to root out the causes of hatred and recruit members from the community to watch out for these kind of stuff.


Good posting Snipes, I support your opinion.


I third that. I don't support racial profiling at all.

Everyone should have to follow the same rules and go through the same security checks. Muslims being further marginalised will only cause more problems - I wouldn't want that for my Muslim friends.
kanelli
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Aug 17, 2006
It's not only muslims that will be stopped during racial profiling. You could be black, or of olive skin, anyone ethnic looking, but they don't necessarily have to be muslim. However everyone should go through the same checks as it really doesn't matter what people look like anymore.
Chocoholic
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Aug 17, 2006
[Quote="Chocoholic"]It's not only muslims that will be stopped during racial profiling. You could be black

And why would anyone want to racial profile other persons when history has shown that the "ones" the authorities are targeting are the "ones”

As for these trouble maker "ones" they need to be dealt with lot harsher

What has gone wrong with the authorities, they use to give "one" a nice bit of flogging and a few neck parties and then that would get them back in line and then they would soon know who was the Masters?
:twisted:
chevaliers-de-sion
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Aug 17, 2006
And you my friend are a bit of a cretin.

Actually had a weird conversation with someone the other night, who said that maybe the world isn't ready to be so intergrated.
Chocoholic
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Aug 17, 2006
chevaliers-de-sion wrote:
Chocoholic wrote:It's not only muslims that will be stopped during racial profiling. You could be black

And why would anyone want to racial profile other persons when history has shown that the "ones" the authorities are targeting are the "ones”

As for these trouble maker "ones" they need to be dealt with lot harsher

What has gone wrong with the authorities, they use to give "one" a nice bit of flogging and a few neck parties and then that would get them back in line and then they would soon know who was the Masters?
:twisted:


do u want to be spanked?
sniper420
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Aug 17, 2006
Integrated. !!!!

Hevans NO!............ Have you not read your BIBLE?
chevaliers-de-sion
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Aug 17, 2006
Never have and never will! It's all that crap which causes the problems in the first place!
Chocoholic
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Aug 17, 2006
Chocoholic wrote:People will always say that these things are racist etc etc etc. However that's the price you pay when only certain members of society are making and willing to carry out threats, and it's also upto their own to weed out those that would do harm.



MMM well I guess Choco u should ppicture urselves int he situation b4 saying something like this.
Why is it always the minorities come under the microscope and face increased scrutiny? Picture this bunch of caucasian Brits are caught up bringing drugs to UAE and the event has occured number of times. Now UAE implements rule saying they will strip search all brits and some caucasians.....now i am a caucasian and why should thousand others suffer from trauma of waiting in a queue? What can a do to prevent drug dealing? I live in my own world and have nothing to do with drugs worse cant get in touch with the guys responsible and give em piece of my mind. Instead i will be pissed at the authorities who implemented this "rascist" rule.
sinilar way i saw Choco asking other muslim members to b responsible to deal with extremists...how could they deal when they are not involved in going to mosque or living in community and live in their own world?

Meanwhile the drug dealers get some non-brit or non caucasian who gets over the security over nominal fee... same goes with terrorism.
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