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poor attempt to distract away from his earlier fantasy about child prostitutes and Islam condoning rape.

FD has presented evidence that Islam (and Muslims acting in the name of Islam) condone rape.

What is your evidence/reasoning to discredit what FD has posted?

I'm asked what my views are about Jews, I point out I've given them and then I'm told that why should people believe what I write? Hmm - I guess the logic is that everyone should believe what these 'experts on Islam' believe about others!

Sorry, you must be confused.

Only kanelli has asked you your view on Jews. The other forum members know your views on Jews and non-Muslims by your posts, as Dillon said on the other thread.

The rest of us don't need a sales pitch to know where you stand on Jews.

So let's get this straight. You and FD share a delusion about Islam condoning rape and are trying to convince people that this is the 'truth'?

Really?

Is that the best you can come up with?

FD's fantasy in this thread was about child prostitutes in Pakistan as well - and this anti-Muslim diatribe about Muslims condoning rape. This is not a funny subject and it is quite sick that you hate Muslims so much that you invent these slurs against a religion.

Sad, indeed pathetic.

(And herve will recall that I am a UK citizen, taxpayer and homeowner, and the last time I checked the UK was part of Europe. FD is being delusional again when he imagines that I'm not European. Only racists imagine that a non-White person cannot be European. Herve even makes a distinction between a Muslim and a European, even though one is a religion and one is a broad nationality! Logic isn't a strong point for you guys is it! )

Cheers,
Shafique

FD provided evidence and the best you can come up with is that he hates Islam or Muslims. I note you didn't answer my question why we shouldn't believe what FD has shown and believe you instead.

Hmmm, let's compare FD's evidence that Islam condones rape to the views on Judaism/Jews by an Anti-Semitic Muslim you agree with.

Oh, no. Suddenly that's different.

Go off and avoid any direct arguments.

It's what you do best.

al shafique, how can you claim to be Europeean and try to force down the throats of Europeean values that are anti Europeean, or even illegal.
you clearly have supported sharia and polygamy, which are totally incompatible with European values.
Instead of trying to turn Britain under islamic standards why dont You and your "people" go back to the 3rd world garbage dumps they left behind

zonker wrote:As an aside, non, and I mean non of the Pakistani Muslim families that I know would allow their 13 year old daughters to look at these thugs, leave alone going out with them for drinking alcohol! Even 4 year old children know not to talk to strangers!

Shocking.

I hope you are not excusing the behaviour of these men Zonker. Just because these poor unfortunate girls were vunerable does not excuse adult males from targeting them for under age s.ex.
I wish I was in charge for a day. I'd have the dirty bastards castrated in the mosque on a Friday morning.

Bethsmum wrote:I hope you are not excusing the behaviour of these men Zonker

Certainly not BM! I hope you have read my post fully.
I would help you with their castration if ever you were granted your wish

^I'll help too!

No sane and reasonable person would condone these thugs, and I agree with Zonker's wider point about the parents. Indeed, many groomed girls came from broken homes and care homes, and the initial lure of thugs was to treat them with apparent love and kindness - but this is what thugs who groom girls do (and is NOT something only Pakistani-thugs do).

It is sad that this thread about some UK criminals has cynically been used to slur a religion by the usual anti-Muslim posters. It seems they can't help themselves... a sort of DF tourette syndrome! iI mean, FD's rant about chid prostitutes and Islam condoning rape... c'mon that is just pure hatred.

Cheers,

Shafique

shafique wrote:^I'll help too!

As if.

--- 1 seconds ago ---

shafique wrote:No sane and reasonable person would condone these thugs, and I agree with Zonker's wider point about the parents. Indeed, many groomed girls came from broken homes and care homes, and the initial lure of thugs was to treat them with apparent love and kindness - but this is what thugs who groom girls do (and is NOT something only Pakistani-thugs do).

You used the term 'thugs' four times in that paragraph. I prefer the term 'child rapists'. I think it is more descriptive.
If you describe luring young girls upstairs to ply them with drink and drugs and then raping them as treating them with love and kindness, well that says more about you as a person, I think.

--- Sun Feb 26, 2012 12:02 pm ---

shafique wrote:It is sad that this thread about some UK criminals has cynically been used to slur a religion by the usual anti-Muslim posters. It seems they can't help themselves... a sort of DF tourette syndrome! iI mean, FD's rant about chid prostitutes and Islam condoning rape... c'mon that is just pure hatred.

Some UK criminals? Surely you meant Asian child rapists? That's the way they are described in the UK press anyways. Not all the UK press are anti Muslim are they? Or maybe they are.

shafique wrote:FD's fantasy in this thread was about child prostitutes in Pakistan as well

Child prostitution is real in Pakistan, no fantasy. Your trying to deny it is ing and disgraceful! You and the 'Asian thugs' of the OP belong to the same ilk. For a time I thought you were just a troll and hoot, now I see how dangerous you really are.

Flying Dutchman wrote:You and the 'Asian thugs' of the OP belong to the same ilk

Your fantasies about me are getting creepier and creepier.

Just chill man, chill. It is clear that you retreat into fantasies about Muslim rapes and psychological profiles when you have lost an argument.. you are nothing if not predictable.

'I thought so'. Indeed.

Cheers,

Shafique

And yet the unwillingness the answer:

With whom do you feel you have more in common Shaf, the guy screaming that wives will be taken as booty, or the Europeans who are appalled by this?

shafique wrote:Just chill man, chill. It is clear that you retreat into fantasies about Muslim rapes

No fantasies in this OP. Unfortunately they are very real.

Still, just chill FD - no need to fantasise about Muslims condoning rape or start linking this to child prostitutes.. all because Zonker made the point about parental responsibilities.

BM - I take you now have re-read the quotes from us that show that we don't condone the thugs who groomed these girls. Did you think that Bora, Zonker and myself were excusing the crimes or that we said that Muslims in general aren't abhored by the crimes? If so, isn't this just a figment of your imagination?

Cheers,

Shafique

shafique wrote:BM - I take you now have re-read the quotes from us that show that we don't condone the thugs who groomed these girls. Did you think that Bora, Zonker and myself were excusing the crimes or that we said that Muslims in general aren't abhored by the crimes? If so, isn't this just a figment of your imagination?

I can see you're really enjoying being part of a gang of 3! LOL. There's power in numbers

This must be a new feeling for you, you know, to have friends!

Why are married female captives "available" to Muslim captors?

And all married women (are forbidden unto you) save those (captives) whom your right hands possess. It is a decree of Allah for you. Lawful unto you are all beyond those mentioned, so that ye seek them with your wealth in honest wedlock, not debauchery. And those of whom ye seek content (by marrying them), give unto them their portions as a duty. And there is no sin for you in what ye do by mutual agreement after the duty (hath been done). Lo! Allah is ever Knower, Wise.

I thought shafique said adultery is forbidden in Islam.

BM -Well, at least you are no longer in denial about whether I had condemned the attacks - but as usual, no apology for your lack of reading and comprehension skills.

I'm not sure why you're surprised that we're all in agreement over the anti-Muslim spin that is being put on this crime - or that FD's weak attempt at distraction has failed.

eh - stop believing what your anti-muslim websites tell you about Islam. Start a new thread in religion and we'll put you straight.

Cheers,

Shafique

I thought shafique said adultery is forbidden in Islam.

They should put a memo out. I don't think the message has got around to everyone

--- Sun Feb 26, 2012 2:00 pm ---

shafique wrote:BM -Well, at least you are no longer in denial about whether I had condemned the attacks - but as usual, no apology for your lack of reading and comprehension skills.

All I see is you trying to water down the crimes they are accused of which is rape. That's quite serious in my country you know? We aren't talking about your friends who pinched TV's and Nike trainers in August here! Get with the program Shafique!

--- Sun Feb 26, 2012 2:01 pm ---

Bethsmum wrote:All I see is you trying to water down the crimes they are accused of which is rape

Lets see what Shaf has to say about somebody writing this:

This contradicts you specific target of those hunted in streets...So now are you saying that in reality there are no vulnerable girls...They simply get it becouse they all want it!!!!!!!!!!!!!

How can you say that the relationship of a vulnerable girl is not a consensual one? What proof do you have when it's starting?

If this thread is about loverboys/groomers you should not adress woman as vulnerable in a society where they are found to be free in which s.ex and relationships practised without the concent of parents or without the authentication of marriage...As you proved us that description of a vulnerable woman cannot be narrowed down to those walking astray on streets!!!..

shafique wrote:No sane and reasonable person would condone these thugs, and I agree with Zonker's wider point about the parents. Indeed, many groomed girls came from broken homes and care homes, and the initial lure of thugs was to treat them with apparent love and kindness - but this is what thugs who groom girls do (and is NOT something only Pakistani-thugs do).

Pretty clearly stated my views I thought.

I'm feeling a bit concerned over FD's amnesia and tourette style posting asking my opinion every other post! Perhaps I should feel flattered he keeps asking what I think?

Cheers,

Shafique

Lost your tongue Shaf. Everytime you have an opportunity to show your true colors, you never 'disappoint'.

Huh? You're now losing it big time FD.

Why are you asking me opinion again when I've already given it. Do you think that posting a quote without a link will change my opinion on these criminals? It is pretty easy to assess whether your anonymous quote is line with my stated opinion or out of line with it - so what's your problem?

Cheers,

Shafique

Did you make once the statement that precious jewels should not be placed in front of the window, and if you do you shouldn't complain about theft, and then went on comparing this to scarcely dressed women?

I really do find it hard to take you seriously when you ask me to comment on anonymous cuts and pastes, and some imagined posting you think I made. Your memory has let you down so many times in the past that you should have learnt your lesson by now - don't quote off the top of your head when you can actually quote posts.

Stop wriggling and second-guessing what I think on this subject - I've said clearly that as a European, father, human, Muslim etc I don't support these crimes in any way. Get over this silly obsession with my views/posts. Really.

Chill man - no one on DF has condoned the crimes. Muslims or otherwise. No need for these 'Islam condones rape' arguments!

cheers,

Shafique

shafique wrote:no one on DF has condoned the crimes. Muslims or otherwise.

I am sorry, but Berrin the Muslim, has condoned previous like wise cases. He found nothing wrong with that. Trying to cover up Shaf?

Again, your imagination is running away with you FD. I haven't seen a post in this thread from Berrin (or anyone else) condoning what these criminals have done.

Relax. And this silly notion that you have that if some Muslim somewhere in the blogosphere has committed a crime or posted something that this reflects on all Muslims is as ridiculous as it is funny. Chill man.

Cheers,

Shafique

shafique wrote:And this silly notion that you have that if some Muslim somewhere in the blogosphere has committed a crime or posted something that this reflects on all Muslims is as ridiculous as it is funny

I donot find it funny at all, if another DF-er condones grooming/loverboy activities and when this is tried to be covered up by you. Grooming is not funny Shaf, you have laughed before at wife beating, that is also not funny.

It is your speculation, extrapolation and fantasies that I find funny - the criminals of the OP have only been condemned by people on DF - despite your desperate attempts to find someone who condones them.

Your failure is most definitely funny - next you'll be pinning the JFK assassination on me!

Cheers,

Shafique

I am not imagining, you never condemned the following:

This contradicts you specific target of those hunted in streets...So now are you saying that in reality there are no vulnerable girls...They simply get it becouse they all want it!!!!!!!!!!!!!

http://www.dubaiforums.com/dubai-politics-talk/cousin-marriages-responsible-for-pedo-gangs-t45220-15.html?hilit=mind%20set#p365792

Your desperation is palpable. Your obsession is creepy.

This thread is about some criminals and the fact that everyone has condemned the crimes and criminals only seems to be a source of frustration for you.

As for Berrin's quote - he is saying that this is YOUR argument not his. Sheesh - it is clear from his post that he is not saying he condones attacks on vulnerable girls. Major failure on your part again - and not at all relevant to this thread.

Cheers,

Shafique

The fact that Shafique refers to child rapists as thugs is rather worrying. I thought a thug was someone who went out and committed loutish acts. Rape is considered far more serious in my country and we don't refer to rapists as thugs.

He's obviously losing something in translation here.