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what is happening in Somalia is a real tragedy and I guess the media is not covering it well!

as I have heard the UN programs in poor countries are blood suckers and they don't really make a difference, anyone has an opinion or a background on that!

if for example donations are being made, how and in what means do they reach people who deserve it! or are they being paid as salaries to people who are managing the aids?

I read a FB status which really had an impact on me "while you choose from which dish to eat, in Somalia mothers choose which son to feed "

If those people didn't knock children out by the dozen they wouldn't see the same problems year after year. I wouldn't give a penny of my hard earned cash to the likes of them.

Why don't they practise a bit of self restraint?

If they can't resist the urge to shag everybody and anybody then surely they should use protection against pregnancy.

It makes me sick to see the pictures of mothers turning up with children, half dead from malnutrition! Why have them in the first place? Stupid bloody people!

If I thought I was going to put my kids through that, I wouldn't want to give birth in the first place.

Never mind feeding them, give them all an injection to prevent them from reproducing and do the world a favour.

BM, We aren't allowed to shoot Somalian pirates, so I don't like your chances of giving them all needles.

your point is clear BM, but I don't see the point of punishing kids with hunger for the mistake of their parents!

although your way of thinking is more like to solve the roots of the problem which is right, but I am talking about NOW! and how the UN handle such situations! isn't it human rights (food at least) for the children, is the UN doing its proposed job in a right way!

Mahmoud, if you take one generation out, then it solves the problem.

benwj wrote:BM, We aren't allowed to shoot Somalian pirates, so I don't like your chances of giving them all needles.

In the good old days, ben, the Royal Navy would have just opened fire and dealt with the consequences later.
I'm having problems spelling consequences as am on my second bottle of Jacobs Creek.

Bethsmum wrote:Mahmoud, if you take one generation out, then it solves the problem.

benwj wrote:BM, We aren't allowed to shoot Somalian pirates, so I don't like your chances of giving them all needles.

In the good old days, ben, the Royal Navy would have just opened fire and dealt with the consequences later.
I'm having problems spelling consequences as am on my second bottle of Jacobs Creek.

You can't shoot people BM!
In the good old days the Australian Air Force would just do a survailance flight over the boat refuges... at 200ft and twice the speed of sound. They'd then call the Navy to respond, but all the Navy ever found was a bit of floating debris.

if you can give an excuse to shoot ppl BM, someday someone will give an excuse to do the same to your beloved!
the concept of violence without a real real reason isn't right....

mentioning the second bottle of Jacobs Creek try saying this 10 times quickly :d
"She sells sea shells down by the sea shore"

You can't shoot people BM!
In the good old days the Australian Air Force would just do a survailance flight over the boat refuges... at 200ft and twice the speed of sound. They'd then call the Navy to respond, but all the Navy ever found was a bit of floating debris.

I always liked the Aussie forces

I once 'had' an aussie squaddie called Ian. He had a way with words. I have always admired the Australian Forces since then.

-- Thu Aug 04, 2011 3:35 am --

Mahmoud04 wrote:mentioning the second bottle of Jacobs Creek try saying this 10 times quickly :d
"She sells sea shells down by the sea shore"

We don't say that where I come from Mahmoud. We say something about Ken Dodds dead dogs donger. I can't remember the exact wording as I'm on the second bottle

Such tragedy touches every me to the deepest part of my heart
Anything but humanitarian issues

Looks like I can put another feather in my hat.

And Ausssie grog also. I hope that it is Reserve Jacobs creek chardonary and not the cheap stuff.

Now that you mention it BM, there once was an Aussie guy on DF, Ian, who had a way with words also.
But he was chased off by the old guard. No, No, not chocs, she is not like that. Someone else who is no longer here.
So you will be happy to know that the "good ol days" weren't all that friendly after all.

I entirely agree with BM’s opinions regarding the recurring ‘Human Tragedies’ in the Horn of Africa, the Chinese had the common sense and foresight to impose and enforce a ‘one child per family’ rule in 1979 to avoid overpopulation and it is still in force today!

Regular and predictable drought is a fact of life in the HOA and I’m pretty certain that if the warring factions in that part of the world spent more time and effort securing their food sources and practicing responsible parenting than converting the aid already provided by the likes of ECHO, CARE and OXFAM into arms and ammunition to kill each other, these regular human tragedies could be seriously mitigated if not avoided completely.

No, our Navy would not have just 'opened fire' - please don't go tarnishing the good name of our forces in such a way. Also you cannot just ask for the eradication of a generation of a nation.

Yes, it's always been a problem there, but what is the answer? Many agencies do what they can, but clearly it's no long term solution. The one child per family thing would definitely work for a while - but long term? China is now bearing the problems that came with that decision.

"In the good old days" In the early 19th Century, the British Navy would attack and blow the Al Qawasem ( Al-Qasimi) pirates, who were endemic to Sharjah, Ras al Khaimah and Fujairah out of the water, at any given opportunity, the piracy against British shipping, which was considerable due to the traffic with India at the time, was finally resolved when the British destroyed the Al Qawasem in Ras al Kaimah in 1819, the first maritime treaty between the British and the Sheiks of what later became to be known as the Trucial States, for the Cessation of Plunder and Piracy against British shipping, was signed the following Year.

And I feel pretty confident that China, with a population approaching 1,500,000,000 people, would rather deal with a generation of fat spoilt kids than have to beg the rest of the world for food handouts like the people from the HOA do every 4-5 Years.

Long term solution? Stop buying weapons and killing each other, invest in food source security and family planning.

Fat, spoilt children? It's more like a generation made up of 90% males! Because families favour male babies over female ones, it's becoming extremely one gender biased. We've discussed this before.

Dillon wrote:And I feel pretty confident that China, with a population approaching 1,500,000,000 people, would rather deal with a generation of fat spoilt kids than have to beg the rest of the world for food handouts like the people from the HOA do every 4-5 Years.

Agree to this statement. Moreover, 1979 was not only start of "one family - one child" programm, but also the first year, when PRC reached self-sufficiency in food. It was the first and one of the most important victory of the new policy of Den Xiao Ping.

I guess not only Somalia problem, but also recent "ME revolutions" (except Lybia) were caused by uncontrol birth rate during last 30 years and sparked by very bad situation on the World food market in this year (embargo on export grain in Russia and Ukraine due to the worst drought for 50 years in those countries).

Well uncontrolled birth rates come when you have zero s.e.x education and frown on birth control. You can try and force people to abstain, but they'll still it regardless. Better to educate and give out preventative measures IMHO.

I remember reading an article that all revolutions and popular uprisings that were studied by the authors were preceded by high birth rates.

Vietnam anti-war protests, French, Cuban and Russian revolutions (among others).

I also would agree with Sam Kinison's advice for people starving in some desert. Move out of the desert, durrrrh.

event horizon wrote:Vietnam anti-war protests, French, Cuban and Russian revolutions (among others).

I used to think that the Russian one was caused by bloody war, which cutted population in millions. Moreover Russia had been a net exporter of grain for all Europe for more than 50 years before the war.

event horizon wrote:I remember reading an article that all revolutions and popular uprisings that were studied by the authors were preceded by high birth rates.

Vietnam anti-war protests, French, Cuban and Russian revolutions (among others).

I also would agree with Sam Kinison's advice for people starving in some desert. Move out of the desert, durrrrh.

Interesting. Where would you have them go EH?

Dillon wrote:"In the good old days" In the early 19th Century, the British Navy would attack and blow the Al Qawasem ( Al-Qasimi) pirates, who were endemic to Sharjah, Ras al Khaimah and Fujairah out of the water, at any given opportunity, the piracy against British shipping, which was considerable due to the traffic with India at the time, was finally resolved when the British destroyed the Al Qawasem in Ras al Kaimah in 1819, the first maritime treaty between the British and the Sheiks of what later became to be known as the Trucial States, for the Cessation of Plunder and Piracy against British shipping, was signed the following Year.

And I feel pretty confident that China, with a population approaching 1,500,000,000 people, would rather deal with a generation of fat spoilt kids than have to beg the rest of the world for food handouts like the people from the HOA do every 4-5 Years.

Long term solution? Stop buying weapons and killing each other, invest in food source security and family planning.

Chocoholic wrote:Fat, spoilt children? It's more like a generation made up of 90% males! Because families favour male babies over female ones, it's becoming extremely one gender biased. We've discussed this before.

OK then, I feel pretty confident that China, with a population approaching 1,500,000,000 people, would rather deal with a generation of fat, spoilt and mainly male kids than have to beg the rest of the world for food handouts like the people from the HOA do every 4-5 Years.

Chocoholic wrote:

event horizon wrote:I remember reading an article that all revolutions and popular uprisings that were studied by the authors were preceded by high birth rates.

Vietnam anti-war protests, French, Cuban and Russian revolutions (among others).

I also would agree with Sam Kinison's advice for people starving in some desert. Move out of the desert, durrrrh.

Interesting. Where would you have them go EH?

To US I assume. It's the country with one of the longest coastline with fine climate in the World.

-- Thu Aug 04, 2011 11:18 am --

Chocoholic wrote:Well uncontrolled birth rates come when you have zero s.e.x education and frown on birth control. You can try and force people to abstain, but they'll still it regardless. Better to educate and give out preventative measures IMHO.

It would be difficalt to educate people in a country without pension system like P.R.C. More children you have more chances to have financial support in your old age.

Good point RC. I guess it's a tribal attitude at the end of the day, large families mean more people to work. However, at the moment it means more mouths to feed and in places where poverty is rife it comes a bit null and void.

Red Chief wrote:Interesting. Where would you have them go EH?

To US I assume. It's the country with one of the longest coastline with fine climate in the World.
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The Cubans claimed that part of the US Chief. I would think the UK since the benefits are by far more attractive and very generous. Easy to acclimate to the weather when the payout is so good!!!

Chocoholic wrote:Good point RC. I guess it's a tribal attitude at the end of the day, large families mean more people to work. However, at the moment it means more mouths to feed and in places where poverty is rife it comes a bit null and void.

Er... In a Chinese farm for instance, where all agricultural production was based on human muscle job, the males feed themselves. By the way it's the cause of killing female new-borns.

The problem starts when huge human masses from farms start flooding cities, where there are no jobs for them.

-- Thu Aug 04, 2011 11:39 am --

Bora Bora wrote: I would think the UK since the benefits are by far more attractive and very generous. Easy to acclimate to the weather when the payout is so good!!!

Don't worry, darling, there are enough people in deserts to accomodate both England old and new if you generouly give them that opportunity.


As far as I heard Cubans have already conquared Florida and their birth rates is the highest in US. So the result is obviously positive.

Red Chief wrote:Don't worry, darling, there are enough people in deserts to accomodate both England old and new if you generouly give them that opportunity.


As far as I heard Cubans have already conquared Florida and their birth rates is the highest in US. So the result is defenitely positive.

Difference is, the majority created jobs and have established many businesses and don't see welfare as a life style. As for birth rate, Cubans have a very low fertility rate. It seems that illegal Mexicans are very fertile.

Bora Bora wrote: Difference is, the majority created jobs and have established many businesses and don't see welfare as a life style.

He-he. The majority of Russians did definitely not. I'm sure that Google is not enough to change your attitude.

I'd go for enforced birth control. You cant educate pork.

Red Chief wrote:

Bora Bora wrote: Difference is, the majority created jobs and have established many businesses and don't see welfare as a life style.

He-he. The majority of Russians did definitely not. I'm sure that Google is not enough to change your attitude.

Do you really want to go there???

Bora Bora wrote:

Red Chief wrote:

Bora Bora wrote: Difference is, the majority created jobs and have established many businesses and don't see welfare as a life style.

He-he. The majority of Russians did definitely not. I'm sure that Google is not enough to change your attitude.

Do you really want to go there???

To be frank I've never thought about that but probably something in my words reveals opposite. 20 years ago Russians were very impressed by the gap in comfort with the West, but now everybody drives Japanese cars and eats curry.

Last month I visited a few European capitals and found Moscow much better place to live. On the other hand, Moscow is much cheaper for me as I have a few appartments in the city centre and a few houses in the outskirts.

Red Chief wrote:Do you really want to go there???

To be frank I've never thought about that but probably something in my words reveals opposite. 20 years ago Russians were very impressed by the gap in comfort with the West, but now everybody drives Japanese cars and eats curry.

Last month I visited a few European capitals and found Moscow much better place to live. On the other hand, Moscow is much cheaper for me as I have a few appartments in the city centre and a few houses in the outskirts.

[/quote]

So, are you a slumlord???

I understand that the Cubans may be sharing Florida with the influx of Russians. Sunny Isles Beach is referred to as Little Moscow. Seems to be alot of "Little Moscows" in the US.