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Following the global spread of violent Islamism, British Muslims have faced more scrutiny, criticism and analysis than any other religious community. Yet, despite the often negative portrayal of Islam, thousands of Britons are adopting the religion every year.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/ho ... 75178.html

If you can't beat'em, Join'em , yea

The irony is that I believe the rise in misinformation about Islam is actually partly the cause of the increase in converts to Islam in the west - I mean I'd expect the majority of converts will have compared the reality of Islam with what bloggers have invented Islam teaches - and voted with their feet.

The BBC also had a piece on this yesterday:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-12075931

Cheers,
Shafique

Couldnt agree with you more, the spread of islam has been nothing short of the Inadvertent Viral Marketting Triggered by 9/11. The islamophobes will have a force to reckon with in a decade or two heh

Talk about digging a hole a falling in it ! If they only knew they were doing a great dis service to their own cause.

I guess you could put this down to as one of those " God works in mysterious ways " things

http://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/view/17 ... for-curry/

Converting to Islam does have its perks. The serial killers certainly don't find Islam an unattractive faith.

But in all seriousness, I haven't known a normal person who has converted to Islam.

They're either moonbat types of people or someone who had a major personal crisis in their life.

If thats the case, you should be Muslim before the year is out !

I don't know one person who would consider converting to Islam, but there again i live in a really nice part of England, 99% white and proud. The only muslim at my place of work sits like a frightened rabbit in the corner and daren't say boo because her husband isn't there to instruct her what to say and when to say it. Poor bugger, I feel like giving her a hug or taking her out on the lash

^Hey, BM - you may have missed the main point of the articles - the Muslims converts are white. So '99% white and proud' does not exclude the Muslim converts.

Given your views about Muslims - perhaps one or two of your white colleagues are Muslim and are just hiding it from you?

I'm not sure how many Romanians are Muslim - but God help any Roma Muslims that you come across:

Bethsmum wrote:..
My friend is a prison warder at a top security prison, he says the Romanian Gypes in prison, and there are a lot of them in the UK, are to be feared. Am I racist, hell yes!

Cheers,
Shafique

(BTW - I've got eh and FD on my 'foe' list - I'll leave others to moderate their posts)

Bethsmum wrote: ... say boo because her husband isn't there to instruct her what to say and when to say it.

This point you have raised is a CULTURAL one and not related to RELIGION.

zubber wrote:

Bethsmum wrote: ... say boo because her husband isn't there to instruct her what to say and when to say it.

This point you have raised is a CULTURAL one and not related to RELIGION.

Oh really?? that's very new to me! So the right of divorce,travelling, custody of children etc etc are not given to men in Islam?!! or you have some different Islamic books like Shaf!?

shafique wrote:^Hey, BM - you may have missed the main point of the articles - the Muslims converts are white. So '99% white and proud' does not exclude the Muslim converts.

Maytbe those whites who converted to Islam are not that proud!

melika969 wrote:[
Oh really?? that's very new to me! So the right of divorce,travelling, custody of children etc etc are not given to men in Islam?!! or you have some different Islamic books like Shaf!?

Its NEW to you , because you lack the proper understanding of the religion.

zubber wrote:

melika969 wrote:[
Oh really?? that's very new to me! So the right of divorce,travelling, custody of children etc etc are not given to men in Islam?!! or you have some different Islamic books like Shaf!?

Its NEW to you , because you lack the proper understanding of the religion.

Nopes, you have the hypocrite understanding of the religion!

melika969 wrote:Nopes, you have the hypocrite understanding of the religion!

Define "Hypocrite Understanding"

zubber wrote:

melika969 wrote:Nopes, you have the hypocrite understanding of the religion!

Define "Hypocrite Understanding"

trying to show "wrong" as "right", and "ugly" as "nice"!

Maybe you should look at things like the history of women suffrage and rights in the west. I wonder what "islamic" books they were following id it wasn't cultral. What you see today wasn't the case as little far back as 50 to 60 years ago.

Iran is a one of the worst case scenario of Islam as they follow their own twisted brand of shia Islam, just like Saudi or the Al shabab and the Taliban have their interpretations.

haha, So let the talkers - talk and let the defectors - defect, Soon they will be overwhelmed and will regret their obstinate rebellion

The way that Islam is currently practiced in many countries, with women being segregated, covered, unable to move freely in society as men can - all puts me off Islam as a possible choice if I was looking for a religion. Some of it may be cultural, some religious - by it is really hard to distinguish between the two in many cases.

^I think this was the case for many years and this impression of Islam (justified in many cases) put off women and men from even thinking of choosing Islam as a way of life.

What's remarkable is that there has recently been an increase in those who are indeed looking and asking the questions, and indeed voting with their feet.

I personally think this is just a shift of demographics - I think that at any time there is a section of society that is looking for spirituality and investigating other paths than the ones they were born into. In the past they may have become born-again Christians, nuns, buddhists or extreme vegans (still many of those around) - but I think with the higher profile, many more (than before) are looking at Islam and choosing it as the best of the bunch (for them).

It does, however, take effort to distinguish between the cultural and religious aspects of Islam (and in many cases the Muslim practioners had difficulty in explaining this or even acknowledging the differences) - but not much. There's also a snow-balling effect, new converts have converts that have done the investigations etc to consult and explain things to them.

Cheers,
Shafique

zubber wrote:haha, So let the talkers - talk and let the defectors - defect, Soon they will be overwhelmed and will regret their obstinate rebellion

Honestly speaking Zubs I totally understand where Mel is comming from and she isn't the only Iranian youth who thinks this way. I've met a few with ( and even one very aged Iranian gentleman ) exactly the same views plus if you look around the web there is a whole movement out there. God only knows if I grew up in Iran I'd could very well be an athiest aswell.

Only problem is now these individuals are blind with hate ( or fill in any emotion of your choice here ) and cannot distinguish between the so called oppresive "Islamic" laws and regulations or Iran with the actual teachings of Islam. Which you can also attribute to the mullahcracy for blurring those lines.

So, can a "good" Muslim woman not cover her hair, wear shorts a t-shirt, wear a bikini to the beach and one-piece to the pool, can she freely mix with men who are not her relatives, can she drink alcohol and eat pork, can she date and marry whoever she wants even if they are non-Muslim, can she study and work in whatever field she likes, can she work after marriage and children if she chooses to?

Good Muslim can indeed have her hair uncovered - my wife has her's uncovered for most of the day and partly covered when going out/praying etc.

By definition, a Muslim chooses to follow the rules of Islam - so dressing immodestly (applies to men as well), drinking alcohol and eating pork means one is not following the rules laid down to be a good Muslim, and is therefore being a Muslim flouting the rules.

Of course women can choose to work and study in any field she wishes - barring such things as pole dancing and street-walking - and can indeed work and study and even socialise in environments where she will be mixing with men (that's where the modest dress requirements kick in). Swimwear can be raunchy at home and perhaps at women only swimming sessions, less revealing when not - eg the Burqini.

And yes, women can work after marriage (and get to keep all their earnings to boot - but the hubby has to give her and the kids money).

Just ask Cherie Blair's sister.

Cheers,
Shafique

Adherence to a religion, requires the fulfillment of certain guidelines, the guidelines in itself serve a purpose, this is common to any religion, in order to understand the "guideline" a much broader perspective must be chosen to see exactly why that "guideline" exists.

Rules and regulations exist in every aspect of the human life and is not only restricted to only religions

LOL! HYPOCRITES!!!!

Yes women can uncover their hair just in presence of "Mahram" people! (close family or other women)

Yes they can work and study, if their husband allows them!

They are rules in all aspect of human life, but sometimes in some religions they are in favor of some gender! LOL

Very quickly and briefly

kanelli wrote:So, can a "good" Muslim woman not cover her hair, wear shorts a t-shirt, wear a bikini to the beach and one-piece to the pool,

Well actually even Muslim men have guide lines for modest clothing, and yes speedos isn't one of them.

can she freely mix with men who are not her relatives,

Yes

can she drink alcohol and eat pork,

He can't either

can she date and marry whoever she wants

Yes

even if they are non-Muslim

no

can she study and work in whatever field she likes, can she work after marriage and children if she chooses to?

Absolutely

EDIT : Oops I see a couple of people got in ahead of me !

-- Thu Jan 06, 2011 3:28 pm --

melika969 wrote:LOL! HYPOCRITES!!!!

Yes women can uncover their hair just in presence of "Mahram" people! (close family or other women)

Iranian, Saudi, talibanish rules...not islamic[/quote]

Yes they can work and study, if their husband allows them!

Same answer as above

-- Thu Jan 06, 2011 3:29 pm --

Next you will also say the religious police is also ascribed in Islam.

desertdudeshj wrote:

melika969 wrote:LOL! HYPOCRITES!!!!

Yes women can uncover their hair just in presence of "Mahram" people! (close family or other women)

Iranian, Saudi, talibanish rules...not islamic

Not so sure about that..

In conclusion, I feel that there is a very strong case to be made that Surah an-Nur ayah 31 does not make niqab fard, but in fact allows the display of the face and hands.

http://www.islamfortoday.com/almuhajabah01.htm

.

The wife of Imam Rauf (he of the Park 51 cultural centre in Manhattan) is Daisy Khan - she has her own job and this is how she appears in public:


http://www.asmasociety.org/about/b_dkhan.html

So now cover is not mandatory in Islam? what's next? eating pork and alcohol is halal too?

Well I leave this to others ro read and judge!

Following a moderate style or personal will in a predominantly christian country is one thing practising modesty by the procedures decribed by the law of God is another thing...

I don't think a scarf looks worse than a hat...
http://www.zimbio.com/pictures/2sG70uzy ... ip+Erdogan

And I don't think there is anything to fear or deny about hair being an adornment of women...

The God you are talking about and his laws are not very welcome here.

It's not about the way it looks ,it's about freedom of choice!

shafique wrote:^Hey, BM - you may have missed the main point of the articles - the Muslims converts are white. So '99% white and proud' does not exclude the Muslim converts.

Given your views about Muslims - perhaps one or two of your white colleagues are Muslim and are just hiding it from you?

I'm not sure how many Romanians are Muslim - but God help any Roma Muslims that you come across:

Bethsmum wrote:..
My friend is a prison warder at a top security prison, he says the Romanian Gypes in prison, and there are a lot of them in the UK, are to be feared. Am I racist, hell yes!

Cheers,
Shafique

(BTW - I've got eh and FD on my 'foe' list - I'll leave others to moderate their posts)

Shaf, I can assure you 100% that non of my friends (I prefer that to colleagues) are Muslim. I know that for sure from the non PC way we talk at work. There is absolutely no way we could talk the way we do in front of a Muslim. I was told an excellent joke this morning but I know if I repeated it here someone would be on my case.

Why do you bring Romanian Muslims into the mix. My comments were about the Gypes in Franklin Prison. my friend didn't elaborate on what religion they were.
I know you think i'm totally against Islam but what I'm against is the 'in your face' aspect of it. When I'm in Dubai I spend a lot of time with my Emirati friend, we get on fine until he starts on about Islam. He can talk BS big style when he starts. I just tell him to shut up and he gets the message.

Why would you have EH or FD on your foe list? This is just an internet forum, there shouldn't be foes. You see, you are just confirming that religion causes wars. I don't have anyone on my foe list. If i don't like what I'm reading i just scan over it and move on. Everyone is entitled to their opinion and should be allowed to express it freely. My relatives fought for free speech, you shouldn't have to moderate it just because it may upset someone.