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Defects and merits of Christianity , Hinduism, Islam

Hinduism has two defects. The first is that all the rituals are not conducted in the mother tongue. The rituals involve hymns in Sanskrit. In the ancient days, Sanskrit was the mother tongue of the sages. They understood the meaning of the rituals and were very much interested in God. Every ritual explains about God only directly are indirectly. Today the rituals are like the dead bodies without life. Their real aim and purpose is lost. Not even a trace of devotion is developed through any ritual. At least the priest should translate the hymns and should create interest in the ritual. If you observe the other religions, this defect does not exist because all their rituals are performed in their mother tongue.

This is the reason for the sincere devotion in Christianity and Islam. Added to this, like Ghee for fire, the concept of only one present human birth in the other religions has developed tremendous interest in God due to fear. In Hinduism the belief of several future human births brought lenience towards spiritual field. If you allow the candidate to pass the examinations in several attempts, no serious view can be developed. If you say that one has to pass the examination in single attempt, the education system will be perfect. Observing the other religions must rectify these two defects.

Christianity and Islam have their own defects. They should also rectify their defects by observing Hinduism. Selfishness, pathetic scenes and fear develop their belief in God. If you want to develop interest in God by saying that Jesus suffered for your sins and by showing the pathetic scene of crucifixion, it is not real and pure love. When you get interest in Jesus since He suffered for your sins, your love to Him is only based on selfishness. Your love to Jesus should be based on His divine personality and knowledge without any trace of selfishness. Similarly, these two religions try to create fear in the minds of human beings by mentioning the permanent hell. Fear should not be the basis for the love to God. The love should be spontaneous and without any selfishness in a free atmosphere. The reason for this deficiency in the foreign religions is due to absence of metaphysics in the scriptures.

Those scriptures mainly deal with the development of proper human behavior to balance the society. Such scriptures are mainly dealing with ethics only and not with the philosophy of God like the nature of God, path to please God etc. The analytical development in the spiritual knowledge is not much in these scriptures. They have confined God to the path of Pravrutti only and God is simply an administrator bound by His own rules. He is just a judge to deliver the judgment and a jailer who jails the sinners. He is just a mechanical examiner without any freedom or love to devotees. He cannot go beyond the rules of justice. Of course, all this is good for the initial development of the human beings.

Mere happy life in a society is not sufficient because such life is not eternal. The life after death should be also analyzed. Mere judicial procedure is not the ultimate of God. The love towards God, the sacrifice for the sake of God, the concept of contemporary human incarnation for the sake of most beloved devotees etc., are points of higher importance than mere limitation to the petty family only. The view is at the best generalized to the service to the society. Society is only a large family of your colleague souls only. God is beyond society. You must transit from the service to family to the service to the society and finally to the service to God. These three are the subsequent steps in ascending order. The foreign religions are mainly confining to the first two steps only and not to the third step. In the name of the third step they are only staying in the second step (social service) only.

The basis for this deficiency is lack of the concept of contemporary human incarnation. They criticize the idol worship of Hinduism. But they are doing the same in another form in their churches and Mosques. The exploitation of the devotees by priests is common to their religions also because the concept of the contemporary human incarnation is completely eradicated from the root in these religions because the selfish priests do not allow this. The same thing happened in the case of Holy Jesus. Hence, Holy Mohammad did not allow this concept for the fear of such horrible jealousy towards the contemporary human incarnation.

In Hinduism also the selfish priests oppose the contemporary human incarnation. However in Hinduism, this concept is at least partially alive since Gita says that God will come again and again (Yada Yada hi…) and that God will come in human form (Manusheem tanumashritam…).

At the lotus feet of Shri Datta Swami

dattaswami wrote:Defects and merits of Christianity , Hinduism, Islam

Hinduism has two defects. The first is that all the rituals are not conducted in the mother tongue. The rituals involve hymns in Sanskrit.

I see the logic - we should understand the liturgical rites/hymns/prayers we offer. Makes sense to me.

However, having liturgical/scriptures written in languages we don't now use is not limited to Hinduism. The orginal language of the Bible is no longer used - either the OT or the New Testament. Most hearing the Hebrew prayers of Judaism today do not speak the language - but understand the words. Same goes for Muslims - they pray in Arabic, but should also know the meaning of the prayers.

dattaswami wrote:Christianity and Islam have their own defects.

Agree to the former, obviously don't agree to the latter In fact, eh and I agree on the point that the Bible can't be taken at face value and that what was believed a few years ago may have been revised by now - eg whether Matthew is correct that Pilate was not responsible for killing Jesus, or whether Paul's commands for women not to speak in Church should be ignored because he implies something different in another part of the Bible.

I agree that many Muslim practices today aren't correct - but that is a different matter.

dattaswami wrote: They should also rectify their defects by observing Hinduism.

So, what would a Muslim - like me - have to do, or stop doing, to 'rectify' the defects of my religious observance?

Do I have to start believing in reincarnation? If so, perhaps we can explore the philosophy of this doctrine and compare it with what Islam teaches.

Cheers,
Shafique

Loving the representation of mohammed on your site - good luck with that.

eg whether Matthew is correct that Pilate was not responsible for killing Jesus, or whether Paul's commands for women not to speak in Church should be ignored because he implies something different in another part of the Bible.

Kinda like the passages that are ignored in the Koran where 'Allah' commands for disbelievers to be attacked because in one other passage, 'Allah' implies only defensive war (that can only end until Muslim victory).

Still with QB1 I see - but no denial that Matthew says Pilate was not blame for Jesus' killing, and that you never-the-less now believe that Matthew was wrong on this point. Fascinating that.

Cheers,
Shafique

shafique wrote:
Do I have to start believing in reincarnation? If so, perhaps we can explore the philosophy of this doctrine and compare it with what Islam teaches.

Cheers,
Shafique

Dear Shafique,

Thank you very much for the reply.

Where Islam has to change? Yes. Islam has to go a long distance further in terms of really loving Allah and practically serving 'Allah'. I am a well wisher of Islam too. Hence i am impartial from my side. I would like to introduce to you the concept of 'Nivrutti' which is not much stressed in Islam practices. Islam just concentrate on 'Pravrutti' which is obeying of justice and attaining peace in society by loving each other and praying etc and helping poor etc. Definitely it is good. But it is not enough when a person really wishes to reach God and very near to Allah.

Then comes the path called Nivrutti or Path of Liberation. Here love to God is given stress.

Islam believe in all peravading God. How one can love an invisible God? If one love invisible GOd one cannot serve an invisible God. Your child is visible to you and you show the love to them by practically providing whatever they need. Like wise GOd shall be visible to us so that we can prove our love to Him over and above anything in this world.

Thus GOd comes to those who seek Him and really love Him.

When a mother wants to see her child, she does not think about any advantage out of it. Infact the mother presents some cash to the son as a gift and if the son needs, she will even sell all her ornaments and sacrifice for the sake of her son. Similarly, if the person has true love for God, the person wants to see God not for any advantage, but even at the cost of great disadvantage. For such a person, God appears and only such a person can see, talk, touch and even live with God. Only for such persons is there a need for the enquiry of the real form of God. The real form of God is the present Human Incarnation.

God need not pay any heed to the foolish rigid behaviour of some human beings. Infact they want to pray to the formless God or God in the form of a statue, only for the sake of their selfish convenience. You can offer food to the formless God or a statue and then you can eat the entire food. You are satisfied as if you have given meals to God and at the same time you have not even a grain of rice. There are many inconvenient losses and troubles with the human form of God. But the real devotees are not worried about such loss and are infact happy to lose anything if God can enjoy by that. They feel happy when God eats the offered food. The mother visits her son and gives him some cash so that he may enjoy. When the son is happy with that, she derives infinite happiness and does not feel it as a loss or trouble. The mother will stay with her son and serve him day and night if necessary and feels very happy about it. Similarly, these real devotees feel happy to serve the Lord and they are happy about the loss incurred in it.

Thus in Nivrutti God comes in HUMAN FORM to preach and uplift the human souls and direct them towards Him through the practical service done to Him.

Islam do restrict God's prophets only upto Muhammad and do not further allow prophets to come. This is a corruption in Quran. Also, they do not believe GOd come as human form as they only consider Allah sending His messengers as Prophet only.

When Prophet come and deliver the message of Allah, it is Allah who speaks through the Prophet at that point of time when the Prophet is alive, it is Allah who is pervading the Prophet hence at the point of time Allah and Prophet are one and the same. It is like a live wire carrying current. By touching the current we can experience the shock. Like wise God comes to this world in human form by entering the most deserving devotee existing on this earth who is suitable for His mission preach and uplifting the souls here. Such a devotee is also called as 'Son of God' AND the combination of SOn of God and Allah is called as Human Incarnation. Human incarnation is identified by His true divine knoweldge which removes all our spiritual doubts.

event horizon wrote:

eg whether Matthew is correct that Pilate was not responsible for killing Jesus, or whether Paul's commands for women not to speak in Church should be ignored because he implies something different in another part of the Bible.

Kinda like the passages that are ignored in the Koran where 'Allah' commands for disbelievers to be attacked because in one other passage, 'Allah' implies only defensive war (that can only end until Muslim victory).

Q’ran says that a Muslim should protect even the enemy belonging to other religion. It says that a Muslim can speak about the preaching of Allah to the enemy and then leave the enemy in protected place. It never says that the religion should be spread by violence. It speaks about the war for justice, which is not the war for propagation of religion. For that matter, Gita arose only from the state of war, which was fought for establishing justice. Even Bible says that the rigid fools who do not realize should be thrown to the liquid fire, which is violence. Therefore, violence is not wrong. But the cause of violence should be perfectly justified. When Mohammad came, there were three hundred religions, which were quarelling among themselves with lot of violence. He tried His best by preaching the concept of one God. There was no alternative way to subside the violence between them.

Actually after Jesus, the concept of human incarnation was fully realized but this concept was exploited by cheaters. Every fellow became a prophet and declared himself as the human incarnation. The followers started preaching that particular form is only the one God. You can imagine easily the situation at the time. When violence is justified, it is called as punishment given by God. If the violence is not justified, it becomes Chaos due to egoism of a demon, which can be subsided only by divine punishment. Actually at the end, Hinduism speaks about the incarnation of Kalki and Christianity speaks about the final punishment given by God. Both these situations are of terrible violence only.

The last sort of God is only punishment, which can alone bring peace at least temporally for some time when the world is filled with brutal conservative fools, who are the wild beasts in the human form. The Lord says in Bible “Revenge is mine” which means the Lord punishes the unjust people. The Lord said in Gita that He will destroy the evil person (Vinasaya cha….). God is double-edged knife. Not only He protects the justice but also He punishes the injustice. A rich weak human being may protect the justice but may not be able to punish the injustice. A poor strong fellow may punish the injustice but not protect the justice by giving compensation. Thus, the human beings have limitations but the Lord is strong as well as rich and therefore is capable in both sides.

This is the meaning when Jesus mentioned about the divine kingdom on the earth. He means that one may escape the king on this earth but can never escape God. When you are affected by injustice, pray for compensation only (“Ask that shall be given”-Bible) and not for the punishment of enemy. You will be compensated. When you do not pray for the punishment of enemy, you will see the punishment of your enemy soon from God. You may react to your enemy with equal or double force. But God will react with million times of force. Draupadi was pestering Krishna for the destruction of her enemies. The Lord fulfilled her wish but all her sons were killed by enemies and Lord did not protect them. Some times God punishes your enemy through your self. Arjuna killed the enemies, forced by the Lord. But Arjuna was not having the intention to kill the enemies and was against the war. Since he was forced by the Lord, he fought the war for justice.

When Muslims followed Mohammad in His war for unifying the religions, it was justified because there was clear divine instruction. Since Mohammad was the last divine preacher, now the war for justice need not be carried on because in the absence of divine preacher there is every possibility of misunderstanding of every situation as requirement for war of justice. Therefore, the instruction of Mohammad was limited to that time because He was capable of deciding the correct requirement for war for justice. Mohammad removed the concept of human incarnation because the effects of exploitation were severe in that time. Muslims should realize that human incarnation means that God entered in the human body and not that God modified as human body. Mohammad objected only modification of God in to human body. This is not condemning the concept of human incarnation. God only enters the human body and Mohammad himself was the human incarnation because God entered in to Mohammad and gave Q’ran. Gita clearly says that God entered the human body (Manusheem Tanu Asritam..) and that God is not modified in to human body(Avyaktam Vyakti Mapannam…). Bible also says that God is in flesh and does not say that God has become flesh. Thus, there is no difference between three religions.

Actually, Islam is the only religion that categorically calls for warfare against disbelievers.

8:39 - And fight them until there is no more Fitnah (disbelief and polytheism: i.e. worshipping others besides Allah) and the religion (worship) will all be for Allah Alone [in the whole of the world]. But if they cease (worshipping others besides Allah), then certainly, Allah is All-Seer of what they do.

9:29 - Fight those who believe not in God and the Last Day and do not forbid what God and His Messenger have forbidden -- such men as practise not the religion of truth, being of those who have been given the Book -- until they pay the tribute out of hand and have been humbled.

9:123 - O believers, fight the unbelievers who are near to you; and let them find in you a harshness; and know that God is with the godfearing.

9:73 - O Prophet, struggle with the unbelievers and hypocrites, and be thou harsh with them; their refuge is Gehenna -- an evil homecoming!

Muslims must choose to ignore the passages clearly calling for warfare against unbelievers. I applaud Muslims who do, even if most scholars and the companions of the prophet didn't.

Thanks Dattaswami - I'm glad you quoted my statement to eh about Matthew stating that Pilate was not responsible for killing Jesus. Note how he chose not to defend the Bible, but rather attack the Quran with his favourite 'quaint belief' QB1.

At least I guess he is sharing the love and wanted you also to have a laugh at his interpretation - for you rightly pointed out what Islam teaches in terms of loving others.

dattaswami wrote:I would like to introduce to you the concept of 'Nivrutti' which is not much stressed in Islam practices. Islam just concentrate on 'Pravrutti' which is obeying of justice and attaining peace in society by loving each other and praying etc and helping poor etc. Definitely it is good. But it is not enough when a person really wishes to reach God and very near to Allah.

Ok - I would be interested in exploring whether 'Nivrutti' is missing from Islam's teachings and whether introducing it would make my worship better.

....

dattaswami wrote:Thus in Nivrutti God comes in HUMAN FORM to preach and uplift the human souls and direct them towards Him through the practical service done to Him.

Well, I have to agree with you - Islam categorically rejects this concept and actually says that worshiping any idol other than God is one of the greatest sins.

If I understand you correctly, you are arguing that humans cannot fully worship God without having a physical manifestation of God to focus our worship on.

If I have misunderstood, please clarify.

Muhammad, pbuh, was quite clear that God does not take human form and that we should gain nearness to God by direct worship of him. The philosophy of Islam is that we do not, after all, need external conduits to God - but to worship Him directly and that He replies. Is your view therefore that Muhammad, pbuh, was not a Prophet of God (if he was, then his message is from God and can't be a lie).

Cheers,
Shafique

shafique wrote:Thanks Dattaswami - I'm glad you quoted my statement to eh about Matthew stating that Pilate was not responsible for killing Jesus. Note how he chose not to defend the Bible, but rather attack the Quran with his favourite 'quaint belief' QB1.

At least I guess he is sharing the love and wanted you also to have a laugh at his interpretation - for you rightly pointed out what Islam teaches in terms of loving others.

dattaswami wrote:I would like to introduce to you the concept of 'Nivrutti' which is not much stressed in Islam practices. Islam just concentrate on 'Pravrutti' which is obeying of justice and attaining peace in society by loving each other and praying etc and helping poor etc. Definitely it is good. But it is not enough when a person really wishes to reach God and very near to Allah.

Ok - I would be interested in exploring whether 'Nivrutti' is missing from Islam's teachings and whether introducing it would make my worship better.

....

dattaswami wrote:Thus in Nivrutti God comes in HUMAN FORM to preach and uplift the human souls and direct them towards Him through the practical service done to Him.

Well, I have to agree with you - Islam categorically rejects this concept and actually says that worshiping any idol other than God is one of the greatest sins.

If I understand you correctly, you are arguing that humans cannot fully worship God without having a physical manifestation of God to focus our worship on.

If I have misunderstood, please clarify.

Muhammad, pbuh, was quite clear that God does not take human form and that we should gain nearness to God by direct worship of him. The philosophy of Islam is that we do not, after all, need external conduits to God - but to worship Him directly and that He replies. Is your view therefore that Muhammad, pbuh, was not a Prophet of God (if he was, then his message is from God and can't be a lie).

Cheers,
Shafique

Thanks. In Islam view yes Mohammad is not God in human form and only just a messenger. If you analyse, God pervaded Mohammad and God spoke through Mohammad. Thus in effect it is as if, God is speaking to us directly through a medium or Mohammad, and since GOd exists in that medium when that medium was alive, then Mohammad was God since GOd pervaded Him when He was here for the mission of God.

Let me elaborate on Path of Pravrutti and Nivurtti

Meaning of Pravrutti (Path of Justice)

In this, people desire the welfare of their body and family. They love their bodies and their families only. Their real love is not on the God but only on their body and family. When that welfare is disturbed and when it is not possible to rectify it by worldly means, then only they look at God. When you get fever and it is not subsided by the medicines you used, then you are approaching a doctor. Thus God is only an instrument to achieve the welfare of their body and family. They pretend real love on God, which is not real. When you go to the doctor you respect him too much. That respect is not real. That respect is only apparent and the aim of that respect is only that he will cure carefully your disease. These people do not bother about tomorrow.

They don’t bother about the hell after death and about the next birth. Their aim is only the temporary happiness confined to this birth only. They worship God for this purpose, which is not true love at all. God also acts accordingly. He postpones all your bad results to the next births like pro-notes with increased interest. He brings the good results from future births with reduced values like the pre-matured deposits.

The Lord will not save these people in the hell. They will go to the heaven and when the results of their good deeds are finished, they are thrown back to the earth. In the future births, which are full of difficulties only, these people weep scolding the Lord. But the Lord keeps silent, because He acted according to their prayers only in the previous birth. In this field one can worship the Lord with single face, who is Vishnu, the embodiment of Sattvam quality.

With this quality God will help you when you worship. But this quality always requires justice and logic. Therefore, within the rules of the cycle of justice God helps you. He will never harm you for your worship. In this field God in human form is not necessary. God will protect the justice by His power. In this field the aim of the people is not God. Their aim is only protection of justice and their families. Lord Krishna did not fight directly in the war because in this field His power is sufficient to protect the justice. Arjuna was charged with His power and Arjuna fought with the enemies. In this field the devotees can worship formless God or statues and can get apparent and temporary protection in this world.

Meaning of Nivrutti (Path of Liberation)

In this field people want God only. Their aim is the permanent association with the God and not the temporary results in this world. They never care for the worldly justice. They don’t care for their body or family bonds. Their concentration is always on God. Here the justice is also crossed. Prahlada did not care for his father’s death. God came directly and fought with the enemy in his case. Gopikas left every body and every thing for the sake of Lord Krishna. He liberated them in this world itself. God in human form was required by Gopikas and not by Arjuna. Gopikas wanted to see, touch, talk and live with the God. The Lord came in the human form as Krishna for the sake of Gopikas only.

Arjuna wanted only the power of God to protect justice by getting back the kingdom. Therefore, Arjuna worshipped statues like Siva Lingam and energetic body like Siva. Lord Krishna was an instrument for Arjuna in achieving his kingdom. The aim of Arjuna was kingdom and not Krishna. But in the case of Gopikas the aim was Krishna and not anything else or anybody else. They crossed even the traditional justice and ran to Brindavanam to dance with Krishna. They were unable to live for even one minute without Krishna. In this field of Nivrutti the Lord comes down in human form and donates Himself to the devotees. Such human form is called as Datta. In this field the Lord has all the three aspects of Brahma, Vishnu and Rudra. He shows Sattvam of Vishnu, Rajas of Brahma and Tamas of Rudra. In this field He gives troubles when you worship Him. Troubling a devotee unnecessarily is Rajas and Tamas. In this field only the real love on God is proved. When God troubles you after your worship and if you are unable to leave Him still then that is real love. Thus single face Datta (Vishnu) is for Pravrutti and three-faced Datta is for Nivrutti.

God acts according to the field you choose. In Nivrutti only He protects you from hell and takes you to His eternal abode. In this field only He attracts the evil effects of His real devotees and undergoes sufferings to save His devotees. Here the attitude of God is not logic and justice but only pure love. But real devotees oppose this. Therefore, He undergoes the bad results without their knowledge. The God circulates the information regarding Pravrutti and Nivrutti to everybody so that nobody can blame Him later on for their ignorance. Except the motto of information He is not having an intention to attract the people into Nivrutti. He is not benefited in any way by doing so. All the benefit is only for the devotee. The person following the Pravrutti always scolds the Nivrutti. The reason is that he is unable to catch God directly in Nivrutti and therefore, discourages that field with jealousy. When he is unable to succeed in that field he does not want anybody to succeed in that field. He wants to close that field and wants that his field only to remain. Such psychological jealousy is not good because God will punish him. Even though he is incapable he should appreciate others and in such case God will help him to come to Nivrutti. In nutshell God helps in Pravrutti with sympathy only and such help is only in the apparent and temporary rearrangement of your good and bad results. In Nivrutti the fruit is permanent and real and God really loves the devotees.

If you are unable to follow Nivrutti, please be in Pravrutti at least and never become an atheist. You try constantly to follow the Nivrutti. You might have not reached the goal, but you have left your station. Only a person who is always limited to Pravrutti should worry. The attitude towards Pravrutti or Nivrutti comes from the accumulated Sadhana done in several previous births. Such a person turns spontaneously towards Nivrutti and the association of Satguru is only accidental. In the pearl shell one raindrop fallen becomes the pearl. Even if 100 drops fall on mud pond, all the drops become mud water only. Therefore, the deservingness of the devotee due to previous Sadhana is the most important factor and not the close or long association with Satguru. One may sit on the seashore for several hours but he has only a small tumbler in his hand. He can take only a tumbler of water even after sitting for several hours on the seashore. A fellow may come with a pot but he takes a full pot of water in 5 minutes. The Satguru rains His divine knowledge on all the people impartially so that He should not be blamed later on. The knowledge is essential like the rain, but more essential is the deservingness of the devotee that developed based on his sincere spiritual efforts for the past several births continuously (Purva Janma Samskara).

Thanks for the explanation.

I think we agree more than we disagree - when I read what you are saying and get beyond the words, I see that there is some common ground.

Islam does teach that Muslims should focus on the divine and that the object of creation was to do 'Ibadat' or worship of God. Ibadat actually means complete doing complete submission - to become like a slave, from the root word 'abd' or slave.

The Quran also, interestingly, does mention that it was the 'hand of God' that threw some stones at the Battle of Badr - when in reality it was the Prophet, pbuh, who threw them. God is saying in the Quran that at that point it was not the Prophet, pbuh, but God who was doing the throwing.

However, Islam stops short of saying that God has become human - but rather approaches it from the other angle - saying man has lost himself in God and has become an instrument of God. This is the ultimate state of 'nafse mutmainiah' - the 'soul at rest' where 'God is pleased with it and it is pleased with God' - seeing one means seeing the other.

Therefore, it is perhaps language that is separating our view of the other's path. In substance, I recognise what Islam is already teaching and promising as the ultimate goal of worship.

Cheers,
Shafique

Islam has to go a long distance further in terms of really loving Allah and practically serving 'Allah'.

This statement is not true dattaswami. How could a monotheist religion become a religion without the love and service of the creatures towards the creator himself? God doesn’t need religion, it who he creates needs it. In this context, Can you explain the meaning of life and where love stands in it? I guess you further need to research and read about islam.

God and Love
http://www.beautifulislam.net/tellmemor ... d_love.htm

May be you haven’t yet discovered the mystical dimensions of Islam which I believe could help you further understand how people in Islam go towards the truth(God) by means of love and devotion and how they move towards the perfection by subjugating soul (nafs)

http://muslim-canada.org/sufi/sufism.htm
http://science-islam.net/article.php3?i ... 58&lang=en
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nafs