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chevaliers-de-sion · Dec 18, 2009

# High frequency of gender disorder in Gaza; boys born with recessed reproductive organs
# They often live as girls until puberty when their true sex becomes apparent
# They often need complicated sex-change surgery to live normal lives
# [color=#FF80BF]Doctor says prevalence of the condition in Gaza is down to in-breeding [/color

[quote].cnn.com

event horizon · Dec 19, 2009

Why oh why didn't Allah, when he was inserting scientific miracles into the Koran, tell Muhammad that marrying his first cousin was a 'no-no'?

This unfortunate precedent of inbreeding set by Muhammad and his companions certainly seems to explain a lot of the problems in the Muslim world today. Shafique, you did say you were Muslim, correct?

shafique · Dec 19, 2009

It is not surprising that the inhabitants of one of the largest open prisons in the world are having problems - there's no shortage of reports on the suffering of the Gazans because of sanctions etc.

It is no surprise that chev has chosen to make a purile point - but hey, trolls do make the world 'interesting'

This is particularly ironic because they are being punished for a fair and democratic election (a relative rarity in Arab countries). Whether the medical issues raised are due to first cousin marriages is open to debate (my family has personally erred on the side of caution and do not approve of it).

That said, somebody should have told Einstein (the Askenazi genius) about this (he married his first cousin)!

As a Muslim, I'm not allowed to marry my sister or mother etc - but does not rule out marrying cousins - God says so in the Quran.

As a Brit - if it is good enough for the royal family (errr - on second thoughts, perhaps not a good example!) - er, let me try Churchill instead then - he married his cousin, as did Charles Darwin.

eh - did you confirm you were not a redneck and didn't approve of sleeping with one's sister or mother? If you don't approve, presumably you agree with God's commandments on this point?

But hey, who am I kidding - as if Chevalliers and eh are interested in a debate!

Cheers,
Shafique

event horizon · Dec 19, 2009

Well, I guess shafique has more knowledge on genetics than medical doctors and geneticists who are all unanimous that inbreeding - especially generation after generation of inbreeding as seen in the Arab and Muslim world, leads to genetic diseases.

The effects of inbreeding is still interesting. One wonders why first cousin marriage was also not prohibited since it causes higher rates of abnormalities in offspring, especially in low population densities as 7th century Arabia.

desertdudeshj · Dec 19, 2009

Awww....so sweet to see two trolls teaming up. Maybe a forum first. Super troll ! :alien:

shafique · Dec 19, 2009

I wonder if trolls can form a tag-team?

(I half-knew it was futile me name dropping Einstein etc - or mentioning that my family errs on the side of caution - but hey, I've noticed that sometimes trolls do read, perhaps the moon has to be in the right phase or something?)
:bigsmurf:

Berrin · Dec 19, 2009

Why oh why didn't Allah, when he was inserting scientific miracles into the Koran, tell Muhammad that marrying his first cousin was a 'no-no'?

Why don’t you ever ponder and think before you open your large gob EH… Otherwise you know you can’t reflect but only talk a buch of balls…t, don’t you know that eh!…

Of course he wouldn’t tell such nonsence to his prophet…, before his prophet mohammed arrived, there was his adam and eve….That is to say, only few people to populate the whole world...I guess you would also describe their kids idiots marrying their cousins to populate each other eh..

In your case, they were not only idiots to marry their siblings and cousins but were also faboulous humans, able to produce the most magnificant human races amongst themselves such as the black, the brown, the brunette, the blond, the red… the tall, the short...the white looking, chinese looking etc…

Now I wonder if you ever understand what I am talking about? But no.. a Gnat doesn't have that mind power!

In short, This gives lessons..and that if the world population has reached to a significant number than you abandon marrying the person near you genetically therefore should pay efforts to find the right person lives far apart from you to continue healthy population.

But if the circumstanses change and do not allow you to do so..then God sets the rules for borderline as he did in his final revelations in quran…
Isn’t God wonderful that he gives that little bit of room to his creatures for their convience rahter than making life hell for them at the time of crisis.

I love my God in quran and don’t know what you think about your God within yourself…

Berrin · Dec 19, 2009

Awww....so sweet to see two trolls teaming up. Maybe a forum first. Super troll !

DD, no worries…you see when EH gets cornered in one post than he continues the same issue under one of the other accounts he has..It was the same with honour killing..and the same when we talked about foetus rights in quran therefore the genetics issues he introduced on this thread.

You see.. look at the hour of the first post on this thread, within only 2 hours, he sends another post to continue.. using his first post(calm and naive) as an excuse to continue attacking in his second post which actually shows what character he is…

I wonder if the mods can do something about extra accounts of the same person!…

desertdudeshj · Dec 19, 2009

What I dont understand is why both of you are even entertaining these trolls ?

Flying Dutchman · Dec 19, 2009

This is a quite a serious issue in the Arab world:

Arabs suffer from high rate of gene disorders

The report by the Dubai-based Center for Arab Genomic Studies (CAGS) said Arabs have one
of the highest rates of genetic disorders mainly due to consanguinity, or marriages between
close relatives.

Prevalence of genetic diseases is very high in the UAE compared to the rest of the world.

Makes me wonder, who is calling it trolling...

chevaliers-de-sion · Dec 19, 2009

desertdudeshj wrote:Awww....so sweet to see two trolls teaming up. Maybe a forum first. Super troll !

Wow, inbreeding. This helps explain much of the idiocy, stupidity, and mental deformities within the circle of the middle east :pukeleft:

desertdudeshj · Dec 19, 2009

Berrin · Dec 19, 2009

Makes me wonder, who is calling it trolling...

What has trolling got anything to do with the genetics issue set on purpose?
The issues are the work of perpetrator troll that is obsessed with islam and the muslim world..
And it’s so significant that every time this obsessed troll is bashed, he looses all the bit of sense he may have completely…

Wooow indeed..how fasinating this inbreeding within the trolls are..This helps explain much of the idiocy, stupidity, and mental deformities they have..and no wonder why despite all the efforts they can’t get themselves back in line with normal humans like normal people. :pukeleft:

chevaliers-de-sion · Dec 19, 2009

Inbreeding in the mooslim world causes some wierd shit. The Ulas Family in Turkey can't stand up and must walk around on all fours.
www.liveleak.com . . . :usa2:

melika969 · Dec 19, 2009

Wow this is nice, number of trolls growing up, I don’t feel lonely anymore!

Berrin · Dec 19, 2009

You know that you are just a sick mind EH!.
I hope that God will not strike you with his wrath and that if you are single, you’ll never get married and that if you have children God will not show you what a calamity means on your own kids or your grandchildren… I hope that you will not be put into position to remember what you had said and warned about here…
Now just sit back and think of the stories of non-relatives having extremly impared children!

My sympathy goes for those disabled people you mock and that they have much higher value and compassion inside me than healthy but callous people like yourself hanging around us..

Take your lessons now….
And with Him are the keys of the unseen; no one knows them except Him. And He knows what is on the land and in the sea. Not a leaf falls but that He knows it. And no grain is there within the darkness of the earth and no moist or dry [thing] but that is [written] in a clear record. (Al-An`am 6:59)

Say, “Who provides for you from the heaven and the earth? Or who controls hearing and sight and who brings the living out of the dead and brings the dead out of the living and who arranges [every] matter?” They will say, “Allah,” so say, “Then will you not fear Him?” (Surah Yunus V. 31)

And We shall surely test you with something of fear and hunger and a loss of wealth and lives and fruits, but give good tidings to the patient. Those who when disaster strikes them, say, “Indeed we belong to Allah and indeed to Him we will return. (Surah Al-Baqarah, verses 155-156)

Whatever misfortune befalls you, is because of the things your hands have wrought, and for many (of them) He grants forgiveness. (Ash-Shura 42:30)

-I have given birth to a daughter who is visually impaired, and the doctors said that it is genetic. When I found out, I was totally confused and angry because people told me it is the sin of the parent that affects the child. Is this true?
--------
As regards your question, we'd like to tell you that suffering is not necessarily a punishment for a sin one has committed, but it may be a test and trial for some people. Allah allows some people to suffer in order to test their patience and steadfastness. Even Allah’s Prophets and Messengers were made to suffer. Moreover, Allah sometimes allows some people to suffer to test others, how they react to them.

Whenever we encounter suffering we should ask ourselves, “Have we broken any law of Allah? Is the cause of the problem our own misdeeds?” In that case, we should correct the situation. “Could it be a punishment?” Let us repent and ask forgiveness and reform our ways. “Could it be a test and trial for us?” Let us work hard to pass this test. Believers face sufferings with prayers, patience, repentance and good deeds.

Further, your daughter’s visual impairment may seem a calamity to you now, but in time you may find that this is offset by other abilities that she has. Allah has given you a chance to earn a great reward in Paradise if you are patient with her and with your situation.

In this regard, Sheikh M. S. Al-Munajjid, a prominent Saudi Muslim lecturer and author, states:

Not every sickness or handicap is necessarily a punishment; rather it may be a test for the child’s parents, by which Allah will expiate their bad deeds or raise their status in Paradise if they bear this trial with patience. Then if the child grows up, the test will also include him, and if he bears it with patience and faith, then Allah has prepared for the patient one a reward that cannot be measured. Allah says: (Only those who are patient shall receive their reward in full, without reckoning.) (Az-Zumar 39:10)

For us Muslims, life does not end when we die; rather, we believe that beyond death there is Paradise and Hell, in which are true life. Those who did good will find the reward for their good deeds waiting for them with Allah, and those who did evil will find the punishment for their evil deeds waiting for them. Good and evil cannot be equal, and the patience of the one who was tested and bore it with patience will not be wasted with Allah. Indeed, those who were not tested in this world may wish that they had suffered similar calamities when they see the high status attained by those who bore calamities with patience. There is a great deal of evidence to this effect in the Qur’an and Sunnah. Examples of this are as follows:

Allah says, (And certainly, We shall test you with something of fear, hunger, loss of wealth, lives and fruits, but give glad tidings to the patient.) (Al-Baqarah 2:155)

The Messenger of Allah (peace and blessings be upon him) said: “How wonderful is the affair of the believer, for all of it is good, and that applies to no one except the believer. If something good happens to him he gives thanks, and that is good for him, and if something bad befalls him he bears it with patience, and that is good for him.” (Reported by Muslim)

From this, it should be clear to you that the calamities that befall those who seem to us to be innocent— and indeed befall all people —are not necessarily a punishment. Rather they may be a mercy from Allah, but our minds and reason are imperfect and are often unable to understand the wisdom of Allah in such matters. Either we believe that Allah is more just than us, and more wise, and more merciful towards His creation, so we submit to Him and accept His will while also acknowledging our inability to understand the true nature of our own selves.
Or we boast of our imperfect reason and feel proud of our weak selves and insist on calling Allah to account and objecting to His Decree. But such thoughts can never cross the mind of anyone who believes in the existence of a wise Lord, Creator and Sovereign Who is perfect in all ways. If we do that, then we have exposed ourselves to the wrath and vengeance of Allah, but nothing can ever harm Allah. Allah draws attention to this when He says, (He cannot be questioned as to what He does, while they will be questioned.) (Al-Anbiya’ 21:23)

A sign of man’s weakness and shortsightedness is that he focuses on the calamities without paying any attention to the benefits they may bring, and not looking at other blessings that he enjoys and sees around him. For Allah has blessed all people in ways that do not compare with the calamities that may befall them. If there was a man who does a lot of good but occasionally does not do good, then forgetting the good things that he does would be regarded as ingratitude and denial. So how about when this is our attitude towards Allah, to Whom belong the highest attributes, and all of Whose dealings with His creation are good and cannot be bad in any way?

Moreover, the Prophets and Messengers are the most beloved of creation to Allah, yet despite that, they were the most severely tested of mankind and suffered the most calamities. Why? It was not a punishment for them, and it was not because of their insignificance before their Lord. Rather it is because Allah loves them and has stored for them a perfect reward that they will enjoy in Paradise, and He decreed that these calamities should befall them so that He might raise them in status. He does whatever He wills, however He wills, whenever He wills; none can put back His judgment, none can repel His command, and He is All-Wise, All-Knowing. And Allah is Most High, Most Knowledgeable and Most Wise.

chevaliers-de-sion · Dec 20, 2009

"Children" would imply that Paleosimians are human.

shafique · Dec 20, 2009

chevaliers-de-sion wrote:"Children" would imply that Paleosimians are human.

I know you expect people to get angry and react to this racist talk - but I just find it extremely funny that you are just reinforcing the stereotypes of those who hate people because they look different.

I wouldn't be surprised if you and eh also believed black people were sub-human, or even if you continue to believe the Bible is right to blame the Jews for killing Jesus.

These 18th century 'christian' views are now rejected by most thinking people.

I'm also chuckling because it does verify my point that it probably wasn't a debate that you and eh were after!

(Kudos on the humour though - calling Palestinians 'Paleosimians' is a most efficient way to show that you have fully signed up to the propaganda that Palestinians aren't human and therefore don't deserve human rights.)

Cheers,
Shafique

event horizon · Dec 20, 2009

I wouldn't be surprised if you and eh also believed black people were sub-human, or even if you continue to believe the Bible is right to blame the Jews for killing Jesus.

Shafique must be mixing up the Bible and Koran again.

The Koran says unbelievers are the *worst* of Allah's creations.

Koran 98:6 - The unbelievers of the People of the Book and the idolaters shall be in the Fire of Gehenna, therein dwelling forever; those are the worst of creatures.

It's no wonder why Muslims after reading this verse in the Koran and many others like it find it so easy to go out and kill unbelievers.

But hey, shafique can rattle on on 'dehumanization' all he wants. It's not like the Koran dehumanizes unbelievers.

:roll:

shafique · Dec 20, 2009

Yawn.

The Quran is quite clear that the Jews didn't kill Jesus, whilst the 18th Century christians (well 19th, 20th, and 4th to 17th century Christians) all believed the Bible to be true when they blamed the Jews for killing Christ.

It is not surprising that eh chooses to side with chev the chav rather than denounce his racist views. I wouldn't be surprised if he tried to argue that chev the chav is influenced by the Quran.
:bigsmurf:

Cheers,
Shafique

chevaliers-de-sion · Dec 20, 2009

The Koran says unbelievers are the *worst* of Allah's creations. :!:

if it is great why did it make unbelievers :?:

melika969 · Dec 20, 2009

chevaliers-de-sion wrote:The Koran says unbelievers are the *worst* of Allah's creations.
if it is great why did it make unbelievers

Now it comes a long long lecture to answer you...

chevaliers-de-sion · Dec 20, 2009

moosilme brainwashing, disinformation, doctrine,

shafique · Dec 21, 2009

There's no point 'lecturing' someone who calls Palestinians 'less than human'. But then again, most people would disapprove of his views and dissasociate themselves from him - but then again, perhaps if one's islamophobia is strong enough, one may want to believe his views are right?

Cheers,
Shafique

melika969 · Dec 21, 2009

shafique wrote:There's no point 'lecturing' someone who calls Palestinians 'less than human'. But then again, most people would disapprove of his views and dissasociate themselves from him - but then again, perhaps if one's islamophobia is strong enough, one may want to believe his views are right?

Cheers,
Shafique

one is me?

shafique · Dec 21, 2009

Yes, your post which singled out an impending 'lecture' rather than chav's 'less-than-human' comments led me to write that and speculate on the motive (note the use of 'perhaps').

If it was me, I'd distance myself from his comments - but that is just me.

Cheers,
Shafique

melika969 · Dec 21, 2009

So why did you refer me as ONE? Well I know I am one of the kind, but also I have a name!

It s interesting how you relate things to each other, when I said there gonna be long answer to his question

if it is great why did it make unbelievers

How did you relate it to that perhaps I agree with his views? I’m not gonna lie! I didn’t even read his or your views!

shafique · Dec 21, 2009

His previous post was even shorter than the one you quoted (it was only one line).

I assumed you had read it.

I generalised my comments just to be polite.

Cheers,
Shafique

Berrin · Dec 21, 2009

Now it comes a long long lecture to answer you...

Yes that’s right… that is what they are waiting for…and sure I am going to lecture just as someone on the other thread said “ but muslims stay quiet and they don’t disassociate and protest!”

So, Yes here comes personal effort, call it my own jihad and charity not hurting me at all..
But what about you what do you do yourself? Sit and cry for your destination? I am sure that’s the best you can do! Since you can’t disassociate yourself from …whatever you name it..

Shafique must be mixing up the Bible and Koran again.
The Koran says unbelievers are the *worst* of Allah's creations.

Previously, you have been invited to think about the following but you chose not to say a single word which may have brought out the truth inside you rather than possessing falsehood.. And yet you still ignore…
Before you can accuse anyone, you should put your mind to test and decide how many Gods controlling the universe and creatures in it….

But I know a mind of a Gnat cannot come to terms with it…

Then you should ponder why before prophet jesus there was prophet moses and why after prophet jesus, came the prophet mohammed, all conveying the same message inviting people to worship the same God alone…and than ponder why prophethood and revelations ceased after prophet mohammed!…

But I know a Gnat cannot come to terms with such issues…

You should also consider the fact that Judaism rejects Prophets Jesus and Mohammad and Christianity rejects Prophet Mohammad. But Muslims accept as their own prophets, not only Prophets Abraham, Moses and Jesus, but also all other prophets mentioned in the scriptures of the Jews and the Christians.

But a mind of a Gnat cannot come to terms with this..

Muslims also accept their scriptures — both the Old Testament and the New Testament too — as containing the word of God(except distortions). Muslims are commanded not to differentiate between one prophet and another, but to respect and honor them all alike:
(Al `Imran 3:84)-Say (O Muhammad ): "We believe in Allah and in what has been sent down to us, and what was sent down to Ibrahim (Abraham), Isma'il (Ishmael), Ishaque (Isaac), Ya'qub (Jacob) and Al-Asbat [the twelve sons of Ya'qub (Jacob)] and what was given to Musa (Moses), 'Iesa (Jesus) and the Prophets from their Lord. We make no distinction between one another among them and to Him (Allah) we have submitted (in Islam)."

Addressed to Prophet Mohammad:

{To you We sent the Scripture in truth, confirming the scripture that came before it, and guarding it in safety: so judge between them by what God has revealed, and follow not their vain desires, diverging from the Truth that has come to you. To each among you have we prescribed a law and an open way. If God had so willed, He would have made you a single people, but (His plan is) to test you in what He has given you: so strive as in a race in all virtues. The goal of you all is to God; it is He that will show you the truth of the matters in which ye dispute…}* (Al-Ma’idah 5:48)

Allah also said:
{If it had been your Lord's will, they would all have believed,- all who are on earth! (O muhammed) Will you then compel mankind, against their will, to believe?} (Yunus 10:99)

The above declaration of inter-religious harmony is a thousand years older than the American Bill of Rights. Clearly shows that disbelievers/non-muslims are to be left alone provided that they don’t threaten the existence of the religion islam and the life of muslims.…

But a mind of a Gnat cannot deal with this….

So do please show what difference you have from other creatures that don’t have the same mind power to think and give speech like yourselves.

Berrin · Dec 21, 2009

The Koran says unbelievers are the *worst* of Allah's creations.

Koran 98:6 - The unbelievers of the People of the Book and the idolaters shall be in the Fire of Gehenna, therein dwelling forever; those are the worst of creatures.

Nowhere in Quran God says that any of his creation is worst than the other..
It’s your delusions since you can’t bring your mind in line with normal human beings or even further with true believers.

On the contrary, he says all of his creation are given equal chance and qualities to work out the power(God) behind the creation so that you start worshiping to one and only creator. Since Allah wills to create you, it just shows that he loves you and has nothing against you other than his order to confirm his oneness as creator and do your duties as conveyed through his final prophet.

He provides you your health, provides you your abilities to survive, provides you your wealth as a result of your abilities/talent and provides you your food and clean environment for created to exist. Can you say that he provides it all for “free of charge” becouse he thinks you are the worst creation?.
You make yourself fool, worse and disfavoured in the eyes of God becouse you are stubborn and dismiss what is prevailed to you… not to mention what the believers say and try to convince..

A short life here has purpose otherwise it would be meaningless or be eternal…Your purpose here is to gain your eternal destination in the hereafter..The reward doesn’t come cheap. The cost here is that you recognise the creator through his creation, upon recognisition you do your duties as described through his final prophet…

Some analogy..
The coke is tasty, but the formulation is unique and expensive, not everyone knows it other than the owner (creator), so to reach that formulation (the hereafter) you either have to work so hard to achieve it (paradise) or don’t bother but bear the expense/ cost to buy.(hell)..

Unlike the coke owner, If you are a true believer God does not issue a bill that you can’t afford (for paradise) but warrants everyone paradise who follows and please him through his final revelations…

His final messages not only bind people who prefer to follow Islam but everyone of his creation. All major religions are born from middleeast-Arabia and no single person has the right to favour one and condemn the other..

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