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Given it took 4 pages in the other thread to reach an impasse over whether Paul saying women should not speak in Church is a contradiction with the other verses saying women could speak, I thought I'd start a new thread for the next contradiction.

Note we are testing eh-oh's assertion that the New Testament contains no contradictions (a claim we've tested on the Quran in a separate thread).

Continuing with the theme on what Paul may or may not have said, let us examine two accounts in Acts concerning his conversion. One says those with him heard a voice, the other says they didn't:

Did those with Saul/Paul at his conversion hear a voice?

ACT 9:7 And the men which journeyed with him stood speechless, hearing a voice, but seeing no man.

ACT 22:9 And they that were with me saw indeed the light, and were afraid; but they heard not the voice of him that spake to me.

There's more where this came from:
http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/ ... tions.html


Now, to be fair, the best explanation for this I've read is that 'heard not the voice' could mean 'did not understand what was said' - but that would mean stretching the meaning of the Greek words, and would be to second guess all the translators who render 22.9 faithfully. But let's see what eh-oh has to say.

Cheers,
Shafique

Wow shafique. I'm really impressed. From the looks of this, you make it seem like you've thoroughly read Acts to spot these 'contradictions'.

Perhaps it was for this reason that you incorrectly claimed that Paul persuaded Peter to convert Cornelius in Acts 10, were oblivious to the Council of Jerusalem in Acts 15, the conversion of Gentiles by followers of Stephen (the first Christian martyr) in another chapter of Acts and claimed that Paul was the one to change Jesus' ministry by preaching to Gentiles?

Oh yeah. You've definitely done some serious research on the New Testament. Perhaps you can find that reference to the Trinity in Paul's epistles you said he introduced?

Umm - rather than wasting time repeating your prejudices about me, why not address the issue.

I'm not the one who claimed the NT does not contain contradictions.

Let's see what explanation you come up for this one - and how many posts it will take to get an answer.

You can save us all a great deal of time if you just admit 'I don't know' or that 'I have no intention of backing up my claims that the NT contains no contradictions'.

Cheers,
Shafique

shafique oh!

I was simply pointing out that it speaks volumes that you have never read the New Testament (you are making far too many basic mistakes / omissions) but crawl through websites looking for contradictions.

What do you want me to address? That you were unaware that Paul commissioned women as deacons until two months ago (after 'debating' with Christians on this matter for 18 years? lol) or that you were unaware of the council of Jerusalem?

So, after trawling through some websites (serious research here, I see) you've come to the conclusion that the New Testament contains contradictions.

I wonder what is more striking, that you do not have a basic handle on the New Testament and yet you pontificate on a topic you know little about or that your focus isn't about understanding the New Testament, but to come up with talking points from missionary websites you were caught copy-pasting off, that the New Testament says this or that as your form of 'dawah'.

Hey, if you want to waste someone's time on this subject, I already invited you to register on a Christian forum or even a pretty good non-Christian forum that I personally post on.

As for this topic, your knowledge on the New Testament is a mile wide and an inch deep, so why should I bother addressing an issue you're not seriously interested in finding an answer yourself, otherwise your source of reference to NT passages would not have been a missionary Muslim website.

So you agree that this is another contradiction then. Cool.

I don't understand what you believing whether I have read the NT or not has to do with anything - your memory is quite short, for I have told you that I have indeed read the NT. Hence why I know what Christians choose to ignore in the Bible and what they choose to follow (quite sensibly, I say). And you also seem to be confusing me with someone else who didn't know about the contradictory verses concerning women speaking in Church (I stated all along that the fabricated verse was rightly ignored by Christians).

Trying to deflect the argument with personal attacks is just funny - but 10/10 for effort though.

But back to the contradiction.. do you have an explanation or don't you?

Simple question: Did those with Paul hear a voice or not?

Cheers,
Shafique

Well, maybe you'll fool someone into believing your claim that you read the NT.

I'm a little too experienced with you to know that you have a tendency to fib on certain issues - such as the thread where I corrected your belief that Paul was in conflict with the Pharisees over preaching to Gentiles (something I needed to explain to you numerous times) and then your change in argument (on the second page) that this was something you had actually said!

I take it you can't explain away this contradiction then, thank you for at least making this clear in fewer posts than the other thread.

I'll move on to Contradiction No. 3 in due course.

(over the years I've learnt to ignore personal attacks which are meant to disguise a lack of basis for rational argument in support of an irrational view - eg that the NT contains no contradictions)

Cheers,
Shafique

Yes, the New Testament does contradict your interpretation of its passages.

Glad we can agree.

I also notice you make similar basic mistakes on the New Testament in this forum as well.

I'll happily start a new thread to address them.

Still no answer to the question.. interesting that.

Can I conclude you agree that there is a blatant contradiction here and you can't answer the simple question - did those with Paul hear a voice or not?

Cheers,
Shafique

I agree that you believe there are contradictions in the New Testament and I agree that your interpretation of the New Testament contradicts the NT's passages.

Thanks - it would have been easier to say you can't explain away the contradiction I posted and can't answer the simple question - did those with Paul hear a voice or not.

I guess I'll just post one contradiction every now and again and watch you squirm or ignore these.

Cheers,
Shafique