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Now most of your posts talked about the UAE nationals and I think it’s unfair to imply that on all or most nationals. Where I work, I have experienced some useless expats too, they don’t do the job instead they surf the internet all the times searching for cars, boats, hiking gears, mountain bikes etc.
I appreciate the examples you gave and those will certainly have some negatives implication on the majority, I personally know some UAE nationals that you could classify them as unskilled and I am dealing with them everyday, nonetheless it’s due to the government system legacy and they can’t be fully blamed for it. Again, It’s the employer’s responsibility to train, assign tasks, then evaluate the results.

mesheditor wrote: Again, It’s the employer’s responsibility to train, assign tasks, then evaluate the results.

Fine, and then what when the guy doesn't fulfil his tasks, turn up to his training or evaluation meetings, and when he does he spends the whole time chatting on the mobile or trying to get the numbers of the girls in the office, goes home at 2 and laughs because he knows you can't fire him?

I met one local guy who was sent to university in Australia by Dubai Municipality to learn to be a surveyor. He never turned up to a single lecture and ignored all the requests from the university to attend, then complained when they kicked him out? He spent all his days drinking with his Polish girlfriend or smoking shisha and other substances. When DM decided it was time to come home, he just applied for a different course and said he would be a good boy.

Stayed there for 3 years and never got a single qualification but still works for DM! He has a crew of Indian and Philipino surveyors who do his work whilst he sits in the Golden Seashell drinking falooda and chatting to his girlfriend in Australia on the company phone.

Where is the justice in that?



Knight

Agree with that DK, that was the other issue. Couldn't get many of them into training half the time, they just never bothered to show.

As I said before, the women work far harder and take a lot more pride in it than the guys do. I wonder why that is.

Chocoholic wrote:Okay, I'll give you two classic examples. My mother lost her job due to Emiratisation - fine, but once she's gone everyone complained about the local girl that replaced her as she didn't have a clue how to do the job, sat there filing her nails or yapping on the phone all day and basically got everyone else to do the work for her!

My father, a manager for a huge corporation here, was forced to take on a national guy due to having to have a certain number Emiratis on the work force, the girls he took on were fabulous and he had nothing but praise for them as they were brilliant. But the guy! Basically couldn't pull a 10 hour shift, would rock up late, go early, fall alseep at his desk, tlak all day on the phone. In the end the guy quit, saying it was impossible for one person to do the job and that it would take three! Bonus, meaning dadio thanks to the guys admission, was allowed to not have to employ locals.

Let me give you a bigger example dear.

We in a cretin Gov establishment with lots of services to public had to out source most of the services to foreigner companies ( THE EXPERTS ) now, since those are big GOV contracts with high qualification companies profile required ,so to make the story short….. they turned to be by fare the worst , never seen incompetent European and US companies this bad.
100% foreigner employees companies, non of them knows what he is doing. The ones I sat with and I'm sorry to say this are idiots. In fact one of them who is suppose to be an engineering consultant turned to be a TRUCK DRIVER. And so on with the rest of the crew.

Hmm maybe greater research into the company and its employees needed to be done beforehand.

uaekid wrote:Let me give you a bigger example dear.

We in a cretin Gov establishment with lots of services to public had to out source most of the services to foreigner companies ( THE EXPERTS ) now, since those are big GOV contracts with high qualification companies profile required ,so to make the story short….. they turned to be by fare the worst , never seen incompetent European and US companies this bad.
100% foreigner employees companies, non of them knows what he is doing. The ones I sat with and I'm sorry to say this are idiots. In fact one of them who is suppose to be an engineering consultant turned to be a TRUCK DRIVER. And so on with the rest of the crew.

Let me argue like MB just to show how stupid it will come across.

Maybe they were infulenced by all the lazy locals here. They could be Moslems pretending to be Westerners for all we know.

yes I agree, that is merely unacceptable by all means DN. When we interview candidates now we target people from mid class families and those who really want to work because they seriously need it. 3 to 4 moths training, final evaluation to decide if a candidate should continue.

Some new-generation kids don't really know the meaning of being broke or hungry, some who come from rich families also can be very irresponsible and not serious about their career. I agree to some extent that its unfair to hire another guy just to do the DM business, its a complete waste of resources.

You will be surprised that xpats are somehow evolved in the escalation of this problem and my English VP is one of them, he knows that this phenomena exists within his organization yet he acts blind and so hypocrite when he gets confronted ..

and yes, you fire his a** if you want, we did fire few recently.

K-Dog wrote:

uaekid wrote:Let me give you a bigger example dear.

We in a cretin Gov establishment with lots of services to public had to out source most of the services to foreigner companies ( THE EXPERTS ) now, since those are big GOV contracts with high qualification companies profile required ,so to make the story short….. they turned to be by fare the worst , never seen incompetent European and US companies this bad.
100% foreigner employees companies, non of them knows what he is doing. The ones I sat with and I'm sorry to say this are idiots. In fact one of them who is suppose to be an engineering consultant turned to be a TRUCK DRIVER. And so on with the rest of the crew.

Let me argue like MB just to show how stupid it will come across.

Maybe they were infulenced by all the lazy locals here. They could be Moslems pretending to be Westerners for all we know.

I was just trying to make a point here k-dog if it's just a case of pointing fingers!
I guess your mom is still busy with her midnit business meeting to teach you manners boy huh ? enough stupidity for you k the dog

Chocoholic wrote:Hmm maybe greater research into the company and its employees needed to be done beforehand.

it was done but like most of the diplomas dgrees brought from out side, they are all fake. this is how lazy they are.

K-Dog wrote:

uaekid wrote:Let me give you a bigger example dear.

We in a cretin Gov establishment with lots of services to public had to out source most of the services to foreigner companies ( THE EXPERTS ) now, since those are big GOV contracts with high qualification companies profile required ,so to make the story short….. they turned to be by fare the worst , never seen incompetent European and US companies this bad.
100% foreigner employees companies, non of them knows what he is doing. The ones I sat with and I'm sorry to say this are idiots. In fact one of them who is suppose to be an engineering consultant turned to be a TRUCK DRIVER. And so on with the rest of the crew.

Let me argue like MB just to show how stupid it will come across.

Maybe they were infulenced by all the lazy locals here. They could be Moslems pretending to be Westerners for all we know.

That’s a racist thing to say. You are jus an intolerant bigot as BM, moderator should give a warning.

So if you are 100% Westerners thus you must be good at everything - that’s shows how narrow-minded and stupid you are. Don’t forget you are working in A Muslim country whose thinking and ideas get you to work for them in the first place.

How could you lump everyone into a same basket, you jerk

It’s not right to use humour as an alibi to insult others. You are not different from MB even though you want us to believe that you are only using MB’s method for fun. It still shows your inner hates and racism toward the local people and Muslims in general.

You are a real peace of SH…….t, say the least

Make love people, not war.

above posts will have real implications on the long run .. outsourcing must really be handled by an outside company so you're not really telling us something we dont know.

I would certainly outsource for my investments if my business get bigger , UAE govs sectors outsourcing when when they are too occupied so they get committed to focus on other more important issues , dont you ever thing that government will embark on such thing to make others benefit , UAE is smarter that this , all governments around the world are doing the same, so its not our way of thinking,.

K dog is a guy that i don't really want to response to, not even get glimpse of in real time.

UAE makes us what we are today, so lets all appreciate it! long live dubai

i think mb is better in his language compared to some others here.

Cool it everyone.

This got dragged off topic although the point under discussion was the outsourcing of services to western companies and them not performing to requirements.

I have experienced it myself as many european companies look at the Middle East and just think 'stupid natives with lots of money that is easy to take off them'. Many don't understand the culture and walk away as soon as the haggling begins, others just make the price so ridiculously high they think they will get the work simply because they are european and they are all in for a fat paycheck.

The UAE needs to look to its local expat resources, those that have earned the trust and understand the culture, and use them to vet the companies from outside. We are able to see the real and the fake quite easily as well as being able to run the right checks internally to find out how legitimate they are. Quite often they will find that an outside company is not required at all and there are sufficient skills locally.

When doing a major project in Saudi, the client wanted everything to come from Dubai. After a week of research, everything was found in KSA and the only things to come from Dubai were fireworks and me.



Knight

Just chill out and take a joke for once. I myself said it was stupid to say and wanted to make a point about Bangladeshi's posts. Have a sense of humor.

'humor' must have had a new definition lately.

gafoorgk wrote:'humor' must have had a new definition lately.

Sarcasm is getting redefined too, If you ask me...
Some people just need to see a bit more of Peter Russel (the stand-up comedian).

He's a good laugh now and then. Racism out of the door people! Its all fun.

edit: within the proper context offcourse

depends on what humor or sarcasm is made dear

K-Dog wrote:Just chill out and take a joke for once. I myself said it was stupid to say and wanted to make a point about Bangladeshi's posts. Have a sense of humor.

I do have a sense of humour.

I have very good friends from all races and colour, and we beat the heck out of each other especially when it comes to joke. I tease my Europeans friends with a joke like this, “hey, how come your mum forgot to leave a bit longer in her oven (womb). In return, they use all sort of crazy jokes on me. We cool with that, because we are very close friends – no hidden agenda.


Here is an example of bad joke:

In my city we have a mental-ill white group who called themselves “white supremacy” and calling for Hitler’s ideology to be brought back. They take to the street from time to time holding swastikas etc. Ppeople threw rubbishes at them every time they do it.

Now, if I go to white folks whom I never met, and say a joke like this, “you guys are racist because I saw your fellows’ skinheads holding swastikas”. How would you think this innocent people would react to my joke, am sure they’d kick the hell out me. Why, because first the joke is stupid and tasteless, second because I’m using a twisted minority’s action and put it into a joke to demean a whole race. See, it’s not right, huh.

You see, UAE and other Gulf countries are rapidly developing, and they are determined to speed up their societies’ advancement, economically and educationally. In the Arab world it’s a tradition to learn from the best in order to be the best in the future. However, I think that there are wide misconceptions throughout the region that, people who are educated in the West are ought to be good, which is not the case sometime. Japanese students hardly go abroad to study, yet they are on the top when it comes to innovation, technology etc.

Last week a group of secondary school from China went to a trip to Australia for an inter-education program, teachers were shocked to find these Chinese students are far more superior at math, science than even Australian high school student. This discovery has made the Australian education minister to shakes up their education system.

Things are changing worldwide, countries are now well aware that they have to made dramatic changes to their systems to catch up and cope in the 21st century – look at Indian for example. It’s not wrong to copy a good system that’s working well in a European country or in India etc – after all, humans are imitators by nature. Most the technologies that we are using today were based on old versions.

So it’s just logical and wise to judge everyone on his/her merit and personality. Not to mention, as a professional, your work ethic requires you to sincerely point out the things that you think would benefit your organization, and try to leave a positive change so when you go back home people would remember you in a nice way. If I was working the UAE, I would do my best to help them to achieve their long term goals, because it is the least you could do in return for a country that opens its door for you.
Peace/Love

Brother, it's a ridiculous notion that Westerners are more advanced in education!

Where your gov't and public get such rubbish ideas from I have no clue, I dont mean to offend you and our brothers Emiratis.

Look at International Maths Olympiads, Int Maths Contests (for University students), Int Phys/Chem Olympiads, PISA studies etc.

ALL indications point to the fact that Westerners are nowhere near the top in education. Their students are junk most of the time. It's sad that Arabs and Emiratis despite having the richest environments are not anywhere as successful in education and look up to Western education when in reality most other rapidly developing or advanced countries in education take it (western education) as child's play (mostly).

Whether it be Russia, other USSR members (former), developing countries of the Orient (China, Korea), or our brotherly country of Islamic Republic of Iran - easily the most advanced country in the Muslim world in academic terms and many other terms as well despite Western sanctions, propaganda, schemes and threats - the students from these countries always trump the Western ones.

I feel sad for our Arab/Khaleeji/Emirati brothers that they are even behind the West in education standards, you should learn from our Iranian brothers as should we and anybody else.

Maybe it's because Iran is one of the only Islamic countries in the world.
There is statistical correlation afterall, which is what many immature westerners (poorly trained) rely on exclusively for determination of causality.

K-Dog wrote:

uaekid wrote:Let me give you a bigger example dear.

We in a cretin Gov establishment with lots of services to public had to out source most of the services to foreigner companies ( THE EXPERTS ) now, since those are big GOV contracts with high qualification companies profile required ,so to make the story short….. they turned to be by fare the worst , never seen incompetent European and US companies this bad.
100% foreigner employees companies, non of them knows what he is doing. The ones I sat with and I'm sorry to say this are idiots. In fact one of them who is suppose to be an engineering consultant turned to be a TRUCK DRIVER. And so on with the rest of the crew.

Let me argue like MB just to show how stupid it will come across.

Maybe they were infulenced by all the lazy locals here. They could be Moslems pretending to be Westerners for all we know.

Slightly wrong!

They are the third grade rejects of Western society who find no employment in their own home countries.

So they move to some nouveau-riche nonwestern country where the establishment and masses revere the Westerners to no end, and these third grade rejects are seen as highly sophisticated, educated and capable professionals by the ignorant locals (like in Singapore, Hong Kong, UAE, Qatar etc).

K-Dog wrote:Just chill out and take a joke for once. I myself said it was stupid to say and wanted to make a point about Bangladeshi's posts. Have a sense of humor.

Dog, your humour is not appreciated as it was not even funny.

If you are not a Muslim in Dubai, and think of that way about Muslims, why stay in Dubai in the first place? Just leave.

muslimbangladeshi wrote:

K-Dog wrote:Just chill out and take a joke for once. I myself said it was stupid to say and wanted to make a point about Bangladeshi's posts. Have a sense of humor.

Dog, your humour is not appreciated as it was not even funny.

If you are not a Muslim in Dubai, and think of that way about Muslims, why stay in Dubai in the first place? Just leave.

Oh it is very much appreciate and hilarious!

You're not even here so I don't know you're moaning about in the first place.

Miss alcoholic
do you think it's wise to 'survey' a new country/city/emirate from your home to get a feel for how it works, what the locals are like, its norms and traditions are like, before you venture into the unknown?

well, i never thought westerners would care, their history shows that and so does their present.

i kind of disageed with you badly muslimbangladishy and on the other hand I am falling in love with you ..

don't call locals from UAE ignorant again, we are not ignorant, we're probebly the smartest in the world now for many factors and i dont really want to eloberate on this. trust me i have lots of data to support this statement.

I am falling in love with you beause of THIS " If you are not a Muslim in Dubai, and think of that way about Muslims, why stay in Dubai in the first place? Just leave"

THIS IS FROM A PROUD MUSLIM

Proud, but seemingly with a terrible attitude towards others.

Chocoholic wrote::roll: Proud, but seemingly with a terrible attitude towards others.

Maybe terrible, but hey we don't really tend to be this honest in dealing with one an other and that's what this forum is all about ..

THIS IS FROM A PROUD MUSLIM

@mesh: Have you seen anybody here ending his/her post with:

THIS IS FROM A PROUD CHRISTIAN???????????

Remember: we are all human beeings

frankly speaking , with all the stuff we do on day to day, we arent really practicing religions but obviously with all religious bashes i felt like saying that, at the same time I am not saying that we are in a differant level among human beings or anything, it is totally irrelevant. and I wouldnt mind hearing people saying they proud of their religion.

mesheditor wrote:i kind of disageed with you badly muslimbangladishy and on the other hand I am falling in love with you ..

don't call locals from UAE ignorant again, we are not ignorant, we're probebly the smartest in the world now for many factors and i dont really want to eloberate on this. trust me i have lots of data to support this statement.

I am falling in love with you beause of THIS " If you are not a Muslim in Dubai, and think of that way about Muslims, why stay in Dubai in the first place? Just leave"

THIS IS FROM A PROUD MUSLIM

Alhamdulillah brother,
the truth is set to remain and falsehood to perish.

I don't mean to say individual locals of UAE are ignorant. But collective action favouring Westerners for their 'superior' education which is not superior but inferior to Islamic Republic of Iran's students and that of Korea, China, Russia and so many other countries is what I had in mind.

If our Emirati brothers knew (and if Bangladeshis knew) that we should look to copy and excel our Iranian brothers in education and academics, not look towards some drunkard and homosexual westerner for guidance on academic, scientific and similar matter, we would be better off and our alliance would be unshakable Inshallah.

I feel ashamed that neither Bangladeshi nor Emirati nor Kuwaiti, Saudi, Egyptian or many other Muslim countries' students perform very well in International Maths Olympiads, International Maths Competition (for Uni students), International Physics (and other sciences) Olympiads, or ACM-ICPC (International College level programming contest).

The only ray of hope in those contests is our Iranian brothers and sisters. Iran is of course one of the few Islamic Republics in the world and perhaps the only country that supports Muslims and acts against Zionist and Anglo American axis' terroristic, deceptive, violent and treacherous actions and schemes.