Dubai Forums Dubai Discussions Dubai General Chat

1-I'm wounding, since you guys approve of nothing in this country what so ever and you are living and working here, doesn't it makes you hypocrites?

2-When you guys clam there is slavery in the UAE, if you really believe so. Don't you think that you are contributing to this slavery by living working here? I mean we slave them to build building for you for example not for us and with out you being here then their will be no need for those building in the first place and so on. Or is when it comes to earning money then it is ok ?

Don't take it as a sarcasm I'm serious. lets see where your principles stands if you have any!

this is not for me cos i dont criticise uae

uaekid wrote:1-I'm wounding, since you guys approve of nothing in this country what so ever and you are living and working here, doesn't it makes you hypocrites?

2-When you guys clam there is slavery in the UAE, if you really believe so. Don't you think that you are contributing to this slavery by living working here? I mean we slave them to build building for you for example not for us and with out you being here then their will be no need for those building in the first place and so on. Or is when it comes to earning money then it is ok ?

Don't take it as a sarcasm I'm serious. lets see where your principles stands if you have any!

Okay, I'll give you some serious answers! I never said I don't approve of anything in this country. There are lots of things I approve of, otherwise why the heck would I stay? But the point is, many of you see it as perfect and refuse to admit that there are problems and issues that need to be addressed! There are good and bad things in every city, every town, everywhere in the world! But how do you expect to ever improve the problems and issues, if you don't listen to constructive criticism and help and advice on how to make things better.

Personally I now think that Dubai has gone over the top. For me it was great about 6 or 7 years ago! However, the wheels of progress have kept on turning and Dubai and the UAE has opened it's gates to tourism and unwanted elements that will inevitably come with that, so unfortunately you're just going to have to deal with it. I want bad elemtns here about as much as you do! However they do exist, and there is no point whatsoever in denying it, or burying your head in the sand about it! The issue is, how can everyone - working together - make the best out of the place, for locals and expats alike!

Now, when it come to the issue of slavery, if you're looking at it in base terms yes it exists! It's prolific! Children taken from their families to ride as jockeys - thankfully this has now been banned. However when we're talking about construction workers, we know full well that these people have little choice, that they either stay in their home country and have no work, or come here and get paid very little. We know that their own people trick them into coming here, take their passports etc etc etc. We know that some maids are treated badly etc etc. This we all know very well. The issue at hand is what can be done to make things better for these people? It's a question of human rights, of protecting peoples interests, of treating them like human beings, and not property that others can do with as they please.

I mean, did you know that all the labourers used to be carted around in cattle lorries? It took the King of Jordan to complain, before they got buses!

Dubai is growing too fast and the powers that be are not coping with it. You need infrastructure, you can't build somehting as fast as you can and then worry about sewage systems, road networks etc, it all has to be planned at the same time!

Now also the guys doing the buildings are unskilled. My cousins are in the building industry and they earn a fortune, because they have trained for years to do what they do! But as the saying goes 'you pay peanuts, you're going to get monkeys'. I've been to a fair few building launches here and know some contractors and they all openly admit, that these beautiful, sparkling skyscrapers will only last 30 or 40 years before they crumble. Now do you want a city that is built on quality? Or one that has short term life and has to be levelled and and started again.

It's like the taxi drivers. Why do you think they refuse certain people, or refuse to go on certain routes? They have to put 370Dhs on the meter before they even make anything? Criminal! So who loses? The customer of course. Give them a basic wage, with commission, then you wouldn't have these prolems in the first place.

It's really not rocket science, it's about making things work - efficiently and for the good of all, not just for a few.

It's about educating people!

I don't criticize the UAE either.

take out the ban thingy dudes!!!! hehehehehehehe

Awsome, so you two - RB and Del are going to float through life with rose tinted glasses always saying that everything is perfect and ok - wow! It must be great to be that ignorant and uncaring about the world around you.

sharfraz wrote:take out the ban thingy dudes!!!! hehehehehehehe

This is one thing that I definately agree with. People should be allowed to change jobs and move freely from one company to another or change sector, like anywhere else in the world. It encourages competitiveness and also for people to invest in the UAE and see it as a more long term stop than, the short term get as much as you can out of it before you go attitude.

yeah take a look at this way!!!

how do you expect your employer to get you the NOC when you switch to another employer for high salary or for some advantage....

something to think about for the UAE government!!!!!

No country or society is ever perfect.

As residents of this City/country we have a right to comment on what is happening here, our home, on a day to day basis.

We sometimes forget that this is not a democracy and that decisions, right or wrong, are taken on our behalf by people who are not elected.

I think all of the residents of this city want a fair, safe and better place to live. That is why we came here. let's face it, the days of massive expat salaries are in the past. We choose to live here because it offers other things. Yes it offends me to see the squalid conditions that some of the people live in here. It also offends me to see blatant double standards where one resident is treated differently to another based on colour or creed.

UAEKID: Do not think that everbody is here to run down your City and country....we are all residents here and we all want a better place to live.

I sense that you want to create some mischief that really does not exist.

@all
If you were to choose between UAE & USA which country you will choose to stay/live/work?

ArchitectRoel wrote:@all
If you were to choose between UAE & USA which country you will choose to stay/live/work?

and the offer!!!!!?

Chocoholic wrote:Awsome, so you two - RB and Del are going to float through life with rose tinted glasses always saying that everything is perfect and ok - wow! It must be great to be that ignorant and uncaring about the world around you.

chocs i never said UAE was perfect. there is nothing on earth that is perfect. you will never get a perfect husband, wife or even bf or gf.

I agree with you that construction workers are treated like slaves. but you have said it yourself they have little choice. they can live in their own country and try finding a job which might take years or get a job in uae.

I own a contracting company where we supply labourers to construction companies. We do not treat our labourers like SLAVES. we provide them with the best possible accomodation and the best food we can. But you will find others who are using them like slaves.

i never said uae was perfect. uae has its benefits and disadvantages. and its the same for uk or any other country.

but UAEkid does have a point. especially when it comes to westerners who will criticise uae, its religion and even its customs.

UAE is developing and it is still learning. you mentioned about kids being used as jockeys before. they learnt from this mistake and they banned kids from being jockeys. you mentioned how labourers were transported around in trucks. they learnt from this mistake and provided labourers with buses. you mentioned about house maid abuse and i m sure they will certainly learn from that and implement laws for it.

UAE is still in a learning phase. it is not like UK where it is completed developed. nope UAE got a long way to go before it is completely developed.

smoggie wrote:we are all residents here and we all want a better place to live.

.

this is something your country should've done for you back home. why are you asking for it here !!

RB, good reply and in your reply you hit the nail on the head! The UAE has alogn way to go before it becomes tryly developed!

Yes, it does. And the only way it can do that is by listening to the people that actually live and work here, about the problems and issues and try to make them better.

The problem I have, is when certain people have the attitude 'if you don't like it leave'! Well what kind of attitude is that? And you'll find that the people that love saying that phrase, are the ones not living in the real world, the ones not doing a normal day job or experiencing the issues that others have. And it's that attitude that has to change.

I agree that visitors and residents alike should respect local culture and religion, but don't get all hypocritical at me and deny that prostitution, drugs, and other bad influences don't exist.

Hey the other day, I was out with some friends and girl walked past with a skirt so short you could actually see her butt cheeks! I actually pulled her aside and told her what she was wearing was totally inappropriate, in ANY country, let alone here!

Hey I'll be the first to approach girls on the beach going topless and wearing things and reminding them that they are not on the Costa Del Sol. But again it's about education! Time and time again, people have called for information leaflets to be handed out at the airport to arrivals or even on aircraft, reminding them to respect local sensitivities. I'm all for that. Swings and roundabouts - if you don't tell people, how will they know. And don't say people should research before they come, because sadly alot of people won't.

Chocoholic wrote:

sharfraz wrote:take out the ban thingy dudes!!!! hehehehehehehe

This is one thing that I definately agree with. People should be allowed to change jobs and move freely from one company to another or change sector, like anywhere else in the world. .

before saying that dear , you should've respected the contract you signed befor you came here. you agreed to it didn't you.

[quote="Chocoholic"]

Yes, it does. And the only way it can do that is by listening to the people that actually live and work here, about the problems and issues and try to make them better.


try to make it better,!!! it is better dear and thats why you are here and not anywhere eles !

uaekid wrote:

Chocoholic wrote:

sharfraz wrote:take out the ban thingy dudes!!!! hehehehehehehe

This is one thing that I definately agree with. People should be allowed to change jobs and move freely from one company to another or change sector, like anywhere else in the world. .

before saying that dear , you should've respected the contract you signed befor you came here. you agreed to it didn't you.

what's that got to do with the contract!!!!?

the general uae ban is something not right!!!!

It really is pointless talking to you. I'm beginning to think you're retarded or something, because your sheer lack of basic understanding is shocking!

You asked for honest, serious answers, and people put in the time and gave them to you. But clearly you just don't get it. Every single point that has been made is 100% valid!

People like US are making your country better! If it was left upto someone like you, you'd be going nowhere! I even supported some of your points in my posts!

You have just shown how ridiculous and pathetic you really are and have just pretty much humiliated yourself. So do yourself a favour and go and do whatever it is that you do.

I certainly have no more time to waste with someone who has as little intellect as you.

We're going no where mate!

Sharfraz, he wouldn't know or understand how the system works as he's that pig ignorant about it all clearly.

But yes, the banning system only serves to hinder progress rather than enhance it.

I've managed to change jobs a couple of times and no major issues.

The banning system is pretty much a money making scheme, when you can go to immigration and pay a few thousand dhs for them to lift it. Being blacklisted however, is a whole other matter.

yes, i do criticize the local attitude and their view.

root cause of most of the problems here are not respecting others, not being polite, not having patience, not willing to learn, (lol) not using their f... brain etc.,

gafoorgk wrote:yes, i do criticize the local attitude and their view.

root cause of most of the problems here are not respecting others, not being polite, not having patience, not willing to learn, (lol) not using their f... brain etc.,

Again! A 100% valid point, which happens alot!

You see UAEkid, respect commands respect, you earn it, you don't demand it. How can you expect anyone to have any repect for you, when you treat others so poorly. Maybe you should take a good look at yourself, before you criticise others. Change always starts from within, not with blaming others.

uaekid wrote:

smoggie wrote:we are all residents here and we all want a better place to live.

.

this is something your country should've done for you back home. why are you asking for it here !!

Yes they should.

But your Government invited us here to fulfill the specific skills that were lacking in your country.
In order to secure those skills we have demanded a certain standard of living including lifetime visas. This gives us every right to comment on the society that we live in.

Westerners have supported the economy of this town through OTT rents and house prices, lining the pockets of Shyster landlords and real estate companies.

Been watching and lurking with interest here...

OK, a series of questions to UAEKid:

Are you a sponsor?

Do you or any of your family have 51% shares in any businesses where you are not directly involved, sign the odd paper and take a fee annually?

Do you have any investment in any real estate projects here that your country has built with the specific objective of attracting more expats to come here?

Do you frequent 5* hotel establishments where certain elements of Dubai society are actively made unwelcome and stopped from entering at the security gate?

Do you see any of the tourists who are staying there being stopped?

Have you ever had to pay rent for a small shared space?

Have you ever been on a crowded non air conditioned bus in summer with bars on the windows that stop you from getting out in the event of an accident?

If you ask yourself these questions, then consider what your short term future options are bearing in mind that:

The UAE has applied for membership of the WTO for the year 2010. Part of the stipulations of membership are that there must be a free trade environment. That means no more 51% exclusive company ownership. No more nice sponsorship fees.

So you fall back on your ownership of real estate and the income it can generate. As has been widely reported, the number of empty properties in Dubai is escalating because the local landlords refuse to drop their rents to sensible levels and no-one will pay the ludicrous rents. As the number of people here falls (it is falling at a surprisingly rapid rate...figures from DNAID and the typing bureaus show that the number of visas being cancelled is now at 32,000...per week!!) there will be more property available on the market and less people looking to rent them. As a result, you will end up looking at the glass tower you own and realise that it is empty and costing you heavily to keep it maintained as it was poorly built.

You cannot sell it. No-one wants to buy it. You are stuck with the costs.

So you get in your Hummer and you go to the 5* hotel to 'drown your sorrows' but the security guard stops you at the gate because you are wearing national dress and there is alcohol on sale there and your ruler has decreed that you should not be seen there. You have no choice. Your ruler has made the law.

As the country is in such dire financial condition, the ruler has also decreed that you are no longer going to receive a plot of land or villa for your wedding and you must buy your own...or rent one. Then you find you are being asked to pay 180,000 dhs. a year for a small, pokey 2 bedroom apartment on a building site with no access, water, electricity or sewerage. You want to complain, but the landlord does nothing because just wants your money and doesn't care about the problems of his creation.

So you have to sell your Hummer to pay the rent. What are your other options to get to the coffee shop in Jumeirah where you want to spend your whole day sitting around and chatting to your friends. There is only the bus, or a taxi. The metro would be a good idea, but it doesn't go there. After waiting for 1 hour in the sun, the bus arrives and is overcrowded and there is no room for you, so you take a taxi instead, but the driver has no idea where Jumeirah is as he only arrived in the UAE 2 weeks before, has no training, is forced to work for 6 hours each day for free before he earns anything, and is need of a bath because there was no water that morning in the labour camp where he shares his room with 10 other drivers. Never mind, you will get there eventually and have to pay double the fee because he gets lost every 2 minutes.

And when you get there...you find the coffee shop has been forced to close down because the landlord put the rent up so much, the business was no longer viable. So the Iranian owner has flown back to Tehran to the big villa he has bought and been renovating for the last 10 years from the money he has earned and shipped out of the UAE on a regular basis.

This is YOUR country. If you want your dream to last more than the next 12 months, you had better wake up, smell the hummus and realise that the whole thing is about to crash about your ears if you don't integrate into the 21st century and start to improve the infrastructure.

And who is going to do this for you?

Experts.

From outside the UAE.

Expat experts.

Oh, but you are not going to make them welcome. You will charge them 10 times the price you pay for their electricity and water, extort them for rents, not allow them the freedom to improve their financial position by moving jobs...because (in your eyes) you think you own them and they are there for your benefit.

We like your country. Some of us live here through choice, not because we cannot work anywhere else, and are willing to provide the mentoring and advice learned through hard years of education and experience. Who is listening? Certainly not you. So you may have to suffer the consequences of you short sightedness. The desert can reclaim this city in a very short period of time. There will be plenty of sand for you to bury your head in then.

Just a few thoughts for you.



Knight

Well said that man

Nice one DK! What a great post!

a great kick from DK to the proud KID about his country!!!

Choice is the right word!!!!!

Can't agree anymore DK.

+ 1 great post..DK....

wow !!!!!

facts are put in words very well........

Dubai Knight wrote:Been watching and lurking with interest here...

OK, a series of questions to UAEKid:

Are you a sponsor?

Do you or any of your family have 51% shares in any businesses where you are not directly involved, sign the odd paper and take a fee annually?

Do you have any investment in any real estate projects here that your country has built with the specific objective of attracting more expats to come here?

Do you frequent 5* hotel establishments where certain elements of Dubai society are actively made unwelcome and stopped from entering at the security gate?

Do you see any of the tourists who are staying there being stopped?

Have you ever had to pay rent for a small shared space?

Have you ever been on a crowded non air conditioned bus in summer with bars on the windows that stop you from getting out in the event of an accident?

If you ask yourself these questions, then consider what your short term future options are bearing in mind that:

The UAE has applied for membership of the WTO for the year 2010. Part of the stipulations of membership are that there must be a free trade environment. That means no more 51% exclusive company ownership. No more nice sponsorship fees.

So you fall back on your ownership of real estate and the income it can generate. As has been widely reported, the number of empty properties in Dubai is escalating because the local landlords refuse to drop their rents to sensible levels and no-one will pay the ludicrous rents. As the number of people here falls (it is falling at a surprisingly rapid rate...figures from DNAID and the typing bureaus show that the number of visas being cancelled is now at 32,000...per week!!) there will be more property available on the market and less people looking to rent them. As a result, you will end up looking at the glass tower you own and realise that it is empty and costing you heavily to keep it maintained as it was poorly built.

You cannot sell it. No-one wants to buy it. You are stuck with the costs.

So you get in your Hummer and you go to the 5* hotel to 'drown your sorrows' but the security guard stops you at the gate because you are wearing national dress and there is alcohol on sale there and your ruler has decreed that you should not be seen there. You have no choice. Your ruler has made the law.

As the country is in such dire financial condition, the ruler has also decreed that you are no longer going to receive a plot of land or villa for your wedding and you must buy your own...or rent one. Then you find you are being asked to pay 180,000 dhs. a year for a small, pokey 2 bedroom apartment on a building site with no access, water, electricity or sewerage. You want to complain, but the landlord does nothing because just wants your money and doesn't care about the problems of his creation.

So you have to sell your Hummer to pay the rent. What are your other options to get to the coffee shop in Jumeirah where you want to spend your whole day sitting around and chatting to your friends. There is only the bus, or a taxi. The metro would be a good idea, but it doesn't go there. After waiting for 1 hour in the sun, the bus arrives and is overcrowded and there is no room for you, so you take a taxi instead, but the driver has no idea where Jumeirah is as he only arrived in the UAE 2 weeks before, has no training, is forced to work for 6 hours each day for free before he earns anything, and is need of a bath because there was no water that morning in the labour camp where he shares his room with 10 other drivers. Never mind, you will get there eventually and have to pay double the fee because he gets lost every 2 minutes.

And when you get there...you find the coffee shop has been forced to close down because the landlord put the rent up so much, the business was no longer viable. So the Iranian owner has flown back to Tehran to the big villa he has bought and been renovating for the last 10 years from the money he has earned and shipped out of the UAE on a regular basis.

This is YOUR country. If you want your dream to last more than the next 12 months, you had better wake up, smell the hummus and realise that the whole thing is about to crash about your ears if you don't integrate into the 21st century and start to improve the infrastructure.

And who is going to do this for you?

Experts.

From outside the UAE.

Expat experts.

Oh, but you are not going to make them welcome. You will charge them 10 times the price you pay for their electricity and water, extort them for rents, not allow them the freedom to improve their financial position by moving jobs...because (in your eyes) you think you own them and they are there for your benefit.

We like your country. Some of us live here through choice, not because we cannot work anywhere else, and are willing to provide the mentoring and advice learned through hard years of education and experience. Who is listening? Certainly not you. So you may have to suffer the consequences of you short sightedness. The desert can reclaim this city in a very short period of time. There will be plenty of sand for you to bury your head in then.

Just a few thoughts for you.



Knight

Wow....that's the reality.....made the point. goodone.