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I understand it's against Islam to show imagery portraying the prophet Mohamed, my question is, does this apply to other prophets as well?

i.e. Moses, Jesus?

Well, piet christians also behave badly when someone has made artwork of Jesus smoking weed. People often forget that. And that's because everyone here in Europe sees muslims as a critical danger, and when muslims answer on things like those Mohammed pictures, people here say: ''See, the muslims are aggressive and ruthless''. And by the way, Moses isn't a real important figure like Jesus.

LA wrote:Well, piet christians also behave badly when someone has made artwork of Jesus smoking weed. People often forget that. And that's because everyone here in Europe sees muslims as a critical danger, and when muslims answer on things like those Mohammed pictures, people here say: ''See, the muslims are aggressive and ruthless''. And by the way, Moses isn't a real important figure like Jesus.

Well, for starters, I'm a pretty serious Catholic (serious in my beliefs) and I am not offended by Jesus smoking weed, because I think the lord has a sense of humour... I mean, have you seen the platypus?

As for Moses not being a real important figure? Well I won't answer on behalf of the other 'book' religions, but can you remember those 10 little things called commandments? They were given to Moses... after he lead the jews out of slavery from Egypt... so I think he's kind of important.

Well im 15 and I know about the commandments, although I didn't know the English word for them, here we call them ''de 10 Geboden''. My grandparents are old catholic and they think Moses is not a really important figure in this time.

They, and other people, mostly at old age, are really offended by people making fun of Jesus. Back in some centuries, making fun of any part of the Catholic Church would end in death penalty or a heavy punishment. Because the religion has become less important in the modern western world, we can just make fun of Jesus or someone else freely. The fact that we can do that is not achieved by the Church but by the people and their society during the centuries. In a lot of muslim countries, religion is still very important. Since the Islam is connected to Judaism and Christianity, hopefully the Arab countries will live through the same progress.

God is forgiving... that's a cornerstone of Catholicism and Christianity.
Also, only God has the right to judge people's sins... another cornerstone.

The problem is not religion or belief in it... it is the people that have used the teachings of the prophets for their own wicked end. History has taught us it is usually the most sinful who campaign against others sins.

After all, many anti-p<3n crusader has been exposed as pedophiles.

That is why I had to laugh when they didn't show Mohamed's image in the movie.

Would God care? I doubt it... why would you care on anything that would help your cause... i.e. the faith of your children.

Would Mohamed care? I doubt that too... especially if they used someone particularly good looking.

However, there are many millions of people willing to stand up and speak on behalf of God and Mohamed and ask for death and punishment... breaking their own religious code, for in the book (all books) I believe it says, no man shall falsely bear witness for God...

And then I might also point out that Islam prohibits worship of idols... and yet all throughout the UAE you see pictures of Sheikh Zayed, Mohamed and Khalifa.

Where I come from, that is called hypocrisy.

^ian^ wrote:I understand it's against Islam to show imagery portraying the prophet Mohamed, my question is, does this apply to other prophets as well?

i.e. Moses, Jesus?

In a nutshell - 'yes'.


The reason for this was given by the prophet himself - it is to safeguard against idol worship. Making 'graven images' has a history of leading to idol worship.

The biggest sin in Islam is 'shirk' - associating partners with God, this can take the extreme form of praying to other gods or inanimate objects, but also incorporates venerating or praying to saints or prophets. What starts as strong admiration and love, often does lead to worship.

In a way, the Prophet has been proved right. Some sects of Muslims do pray at the graves of pious saints for their intervention - when the Islamic teachings are to pray for the departed souls and not to ask for their help - prayers should be addressed to God alone.

Some sects even worship religious relics - again a practice that is seen as 'shirk' and happened in all previous religions as well.

Some Shia sects also do not see anything wrong in portraits of the Shia Imams and even the Prophet Muhammad, peace be upon him. However, the non-sunnis will also point out that Shia also pray to saints.

All that said, the clear banning of images as objects of devotion have resulted in all mosques that I know of being free of any depictions/images of humans. So in the act of formal prayers at least, collective or individual, the muslim will be entreating God and God alone.

One other point - I have heard many scholars who say that photographs and video are not forbidden in Islam. Some also say that paintings that are 'true to life' are also allowable - whilst others say that paintings of humans and animals are not allowed. I am of the opinion that photos and artistic paintings are allowable - as both are snapshots of reality and do not pose any threat of becoming objects of worship (generally speaking).

Cheers,
Shafique

shafique wrote:One other point - I have heard many scholars who say that photographs and video are not forbidden in Islam. Some also say that paintings that are 'true to life' are also allowable - whilst others say that paintings of humans and animals are not allowed. I am of the opinion that photos and artistic paintings are allowable - as both are snapshots of reality and do not pose any threat of becoming objects of worship (generally speaking).

Hey thanks for the excellent (as always) answer.

I agree on the last point that the portrayal of Jesus of being the white dude with the long hair and the nice beard, is probably one sculpted through 2000 years and nothing like him... perhaps the risk would be the same with characterisations of Mohamed...

It does at times seem quite silly though. If you didn't understand or even know this part of Islam (i.e. portraying prophets) then the TV show I watched the other night would have come across quite ridiculous.

Edit: This is post 4545 I have made on the forum... I will now auction this post on Souq.com to the highest bidder.

Edit: bugger it's 4546 now... I'm quicker than I know!

^ian^ wrote:
And then I might also point out that Islam prohibits worship of idols... and yet all throughout the UAE you see pictures of Sheikh Zayed, Mohamed and Khalifa.

Where I come from, that is called hypocrisy.

Coming from Britain, I've also found it odd that many countries have photos and paintings of the leaders all over the place. I lived in Africa for a while and the same level of public photos are evident there - even on colourful cloth which is made into dresses and shirts.

However, when I visited the States and the UK earlier this year, I conciously found myself looking at the images on display. I didn't see any of Bush or Blair - but I saw many, many more photos on billboards etc advertising pretty much everything a materialistic person could wish/aspire for.

Now, I do realise the UAE doesn't have a ban on advertising - far from it - but the contrast was quite stark. With a benign 'government' here - there is genuine affection for the Sheikhs - and many of the images put up are by individuals who have chosen to display images of the rulers. I can't condemn them for displaying photos of the ruling family rather than popstars, sportsmen or just of people who are famous for being famous!

I have observed that the numerous photos etc of the Sheikhs is a bit at odds against the islamic principles being discussed in this thread - but have almost always had my head almost bitten off for deigning to criticise the ruling family (when in my mind I wasn't)... and my lesson was that even appearing to criticise is not something to be done here...

Cheers,
Shafique

shafique wrote:

^ian^ wrote:
And then I might also point out that Islam prohibits worship of idols... and yet all throughout the UAE you see pictures of Sheikh Zayed, Mohamed and Khalifa.

Where I come from, that is called hypocrisy.

Coming from Britain, I've also found it odd that many countries have photos and paintings of the leaders all over the place. I lived in Africa for a while and the same level of public photos are evident there - even on colourful cloth which is made into dresses and shirts.

However, when I visited the States and the UK earlier this year, I conciously found myself looking at the images on display. I didn't see any of Bush or Blair - but I saw many, many more photos on billboards etc advertising pretty much everything a materialistic person could wish/aspire for.

Now, I do realise the UAE doesn't have a ban on advertising - far from it - but the contrast was quite stark. With a benign 'government' here - there is genuine affection for the Sheikhs - and many of the images put up are by individuals who have chosen to display images of the rulers. I can't condemn them for displaying photos of the ruling family rather than popstars, sportsmen or just of people who are famous for being famous!

I have observed that the numerous photos etc of the Sheikhs is a bit at odds against the islamic principles being discussed in this thread - but have almost always had my head almost bitten off for deigning to criticise the ruling family (when in my mind I wasn't)... and my lesson was that even appearing to criticise is not something to be done here...

Cheers,
Shafique

Point noted... and a living guy I can understand... like, thanks for the benvolance Mo'.

But Zayed has passed, and I believe the continued adulation is akin to idol worship.

^ian^ wrote:
It does at times seem quite silly though. If you didn't understand or even know this part of Islam (i.e. portraying prophets) then the TV show I watched the other night would have come across quite ridiculous.

Most sensible teachings taken to extreme or out of context will seem nonsensical - that is why the philosophy, reasoning behind the teachings should have some bearing.

'The Message' is a hollywood film about the events at the time of the Prophet, and does a good job of showing the narrative without ever showing an actor playing the Prophet, pbuh.

It's funny, but the scariest film I ever saw was when I was quite young and saw a film on Jesus' life - it wasn't Jesus of Nazareth, but an older one - and the image scared the 'be..j..' out of me was Jesus appearing in the sky after the ressurection. I was probably only 6 or 7 at the time, but it gave me nightmares and no other film has done that!

I think that year they had a marathon 'Jesus' film extravaganza on TV - because I remember watching the first film with my family then starting to watch Jesus of Nazareth and then being put to bed before that film ended (and not wanting to go to bed... 'I want to see if he also gets put on the cross mum!' ... 'Yes he does... go to bed!')

Cheers,
Shafique

^ian^ wrote:Point noted... and a living guy I can understand... like, thanks for the benvolance Mo'.

But Zayed has passed, and I believe the continued adulation is akin to idol worship.

You could say that, but I couldn't possibly comment.

I'd be interested in hearing from someone who can make a good argument for why it isn't akin to idol worship.

Cheers,
Shafique

Religions've died what a religion was meant to be is probably completely opposite to what it is today. I pity those who consider religion before humanity. No one can ever debate and win the topic that one religion is better than other.. it's as simple as that.

TP

TP

Well, that's quite good for your post count.

hmmmm talking about leaders pictures I dont think its wrong. It just doesnt happen in UAE nearly all muslim countries have pictures of their leaders or X-Leaders. I have read that it is wrong to PAINT or EVEN draw a picture of a Human being i guess thats y most of the Islamic Artists around the world didnt make any portraits.

But the pictures you can say are photographs and u will see them across the Islamic world. From Palestine (Yaser Arafats) to even here in UAE (All the Sheikhs) to Pakistan (Quid-e-azam). YOu will even see their pictures of the Currency notes. I know they not REAL pictures but still. So I dont think its wrong. Yes It would be wrong if you stood in front of their pictures and prayed but I have never seen anyone do that. Has anyone?