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Why not just cut the pretence. Dubai and the Emirates advertise themselves as some kind of liberal wonderland in the Arab world where there are vast opportunities and a great exciting life can be found. Granted it's a mecca for some to earn big bucks in the scramble for cash but the reality of the place is different.

For most (those from the Indian sub-continent) it's a land of poor pay, blatant racisim, shabby treatment by employers, long hours and sheer drudgery.

And even the money for professionals from the West is not that great when you take into account the vast cost of housing etc. Often it's a case of London type prices without the London-type wages for these people. I would advise anyone to check closely before they are lured in by promises and then get shackled with a year's advance rent on a ridiculously priced pad.

The supposed "liberal" way of life is a joke. "Newspapers have a large measure of freedom"... as long as they don't question or criticise anyone who matters ie those with power and influence. Just see what would happen then if any of them were brave enough to question the government or ruling families. So, in reality, you have a media operating with one hand tied behind its back, always a dangerous state of affairs.

No real democracy and no elected bodies... now that's really enlightened in the 21st century, isn't it?

It's still technically illegal for unmarried people to co-habit but it's OK, they'll turn a blind to that even though the law stands. How ridiculous is that?

And homo s e x u a l i t y is still illegal. How liberal and forward-thinking is that?

And everyone knows there's no real intergration. As far as the expats go, you've got them living in their little enclaves and socialising in their little enclaves well away from the locals and the migrants from the rest of the world. They think they've sampled local life and culture by a trip to the beach or a few bevvies in a hotel bar.

Sorry, but it's a sham and there's many a wart when you scratch below the surface. There's a long, long way to go before it ever becomes an enlightened, liberal, modern state with freedom for all.

WOW!

GoodBai wrote:Why not just cut the pretence?

Wow is right... I've never been to Dubai but I'm not terribly surprised by your comments. Those whom I know living in Dubai, say the culture is very superficial.

So, to touch on a possible answer to your question... I'd say the aura of a newage, liberal wonderland is calculated to sell the "Dubai lifestyle" to expats and investors on worldwide platform... It's a marketing decision. Another question which might equate with yours is "why does the US administration just cut the guise and say the war waged in the middle east is about oil and drugs?". The truth just isn't a good public relations practice.

I know these statements shed little light on the obvious, but sometimes it's good to have sobering to be reminder that the upper 1% of the world controls the rest. I've also been told by contacts living and working there, that the media enjoys a form of censorship rivaling that which was enforced under Stalin... These same sources say the internet there is totally filtered and regulated... meaning you won't see anything the 'powers that be' don't want you to. Very little seams to get out of the country either. Just try looking up information on 'Yohara'... a company used to comit a multi-million derham property fraud scam. When caught, the whole thing was quickly and quietly hushed up and erased. Understandably, it was bad for business, but it was a little creepy in the way it was buried and forgotten... like it never even existed.

GoodBai wrote:Why not just cut the pretence. Dubai and the Emirates advertise themselves as some kind of liberal wonderland in the Arab world where there are vast opportunities and a great exciting life can be found. Granted it's a mecca for some to earn big bucks in the scramble for cash but the reality of the place is different.

For most (those from the Indian sub-continent) it's a land of poor pay, blatant racisim, shabby treatment by employers, long hours and sheer drudgery.

And even the money for professionals from the West is not that great when you take into account the vast cost of housing etc. Often it's a case of London type prices without the London-type wages for these people. I would advise anyone to check closely before they are lured in by promises and then get shackled with a year's advance rent on a ridiculously priced pad.

The supposed "liberal" way of life is a joke. "Newspapers have a large measure of freedom"... as long as they don't question or criticise anyone who matters ie those with power and influence. Just see what would happen then if any of them were brave enough to question the government or ruling families. So, in reality, you have a media operating with one hand tied behind its back, always a dangerous state of affairs.

No real democracy and no elected bodies... now that's really enlightened in the 21st century, isn't it?

It's still technically illegal for unmarried people to co-habit but it's OK, they'll turn a blind to that even though the law stands. How ridiculous is that?

And homo s e x u a l i t y is still illegal. How liberal and forward-thinking is that?

And everyone knows there's no real intergration. As far as the expats go, you've got them living in their little enclaves and socialising in their little enclaves well away from the locals and the migrants from the rest of the world. They think they've sampled local life and culture by a trip to the beach or a few bevvies in a hotel bar.

Sorry, but it's a sham and there's many a wart when you scratch below the surface. There's a long, long way to go before it ever becomes an enlightened, liberal, modern state with freedom for all.

mmmmmmmmmm well said. It is true the standard of living has gome down for the immigrants there. Well about h0m0sexuality , there is going underground like liban's cedar loving male group....

GoodBai ..

If you like the situation here in Dubai, then you are most welcomed.
If you dislike the situation here in Dxb, then you know the way to the airport. I believe no one forced you to come live, work, or even visit Dubai.

Im a local citizen of Dubai, and I think life here is fine. Its million times much better than any other place. Yes the rents are expensive and salaries are not always high, but since you know that why are you still here and complaning..?

You as well as many others always talk about the labors who works for 12 hours to show that we give no respect.
Well, what respect did their countries gave them..? Tell me..? Their countries dont give a damn about them.
My grand father has a company, a construction one, and he has about 40 indian workers and he treats them with full respect .. he provide them with food, water, shelter, and if any of them wants to go and visit his family in India, he gives them free tickets and give him some gifts to give his family. He also support them if any of them decided to get married. In any ceremony, he invites them to come to his house and he ask me to serve them food and coffee. Im happy of this situation, and Im sure they are happy with this situation.

If some companies adminstrations are rude to its workers, then do not blame Dubai as a gov or city or people. Those adminstrations do not represent us. Everybody represents him self .. people here do not talk or act on behalf of the whole city.
Choose the proper words when you post next time.

And you never talk about racism please .. you should be grown up enough to know the gov. is not racist, if some people are then they represnt themselves. I believe racism is found everywhere in all the other countries.
Seriously .. How old are you..?

Peace.

I must say that I am sick and tired of hearing expats whinge about life in Dubai. I am an expat myself and been living here for 5 years now. There have been times when I have been thinking of heading home due to many reasons but evaluating the situation I have decided to stay on in Dubai because the opportunites were better here than back home. I come from Sydney which is easily once of the best cities in the world but at the moment I can get a better job here because of the lack of skilled labour in this country. If this situation changes and I am worse of being in Dubai then I will pack my bags and head home, rather than whinge constantly about how Dubai is not treating me right. I suggest that you do the same thing..........

Barzie, It doesn't bother me that you seem to be a shallow Aussie who prefers not to think too deeply about things. That your world purely revolves around where you can get the most dollars and stuff to looking a little below the surface of a country where you live but what does irk me a little is that you attempt to dismiss those who maybe try to do so as "whingers."

Thanks for your detailed response to the matters I outlined. I notice you list your interests as "anything that doesn't require too much thought process". Why doesn't that surprise me. Perhaps you would be better off joining in chats about your fave film or lads' magazine or the opening of a Pizza Hut rather than attempting a political discussion.

DubaiMan wrote: Just try looking up information on 'Yohara'... a company used to comit a multi-million derham property fraud scam. When caught, the whole thing was quickly and quietly hushed up and erased. Understandably, it was bad for business, but it was a little creepy in the way it was buried and forgotten... like it never even existed.

Salam friend,

If i may... what was the situation about the company Yohara?. Was it there in the AE?.
You know... in Italy we have a lot of "dirty situations"... Italian politicians are ridiculous moreover now we have a Premier who is a clown:)))
but.. there in the AE... i thought the situation was different...
Are you so kind to tell me more about the "Yohara" affair?. It might be an interesting political analysis...
If you wish to discuss... here i am... before some nice women, during the night, wish to talk with me...
Thank you and in stand by... to listen you... shukran...

Dario

I do agree that many people moan about far too much stuff BUT on the flip side, Dubai wants to be considered as a forward thinking, progressive, city of the future, well then it has a lot of catching up to do with other major cities across the globe, and you know what how will the authorities and government ever know how to improve the place if people DON'T complain.

Symmetric, good for your family the way they look after their employees, but the Government is absolutely responsible, the reputation of the construction industry has been tarnished in the UAE because of the way many companies treat their employees and the only way to stop it is for the authorities to blacklist and fine them. There absolutely needs to be more regulation in the UAE.

It's a really nice idea to say that employers should treat employees with respect etc etc, but look at the state of many companies here, it's because of the lack of regulation and the fact that the ministries have turned a blind eye for so long that the global reputation is disgraceful.

But it is getting better thankfully.

dario wrote:

DubaiMan wrote: Just try looking up information on 'Yohara'... a company used to comit a multi-million derham property fraud scam. When caught, the whole thing was quickly and quietly hushed up and erased. Understandably, it was bad for business, but it was a little creepy in the way it was buried and forgotten... like it never even existed.

Are you so kind to tell me more about the "Yohara" affair?. It might be an interesting political analysis...

Dario

Dario...

After quite a bit of searching, these short press releases were the only online information I was able to find on the scam real estate company Yohara, and it's ‘mastermind' Muzzafar Akhtar -
http://www.gulfnews.com/Articles/Nation ... eID=153157
http://www.gulf-news.com/Articles/Natio ... eID=167533
http://www.gulfnews.com/Articles/Nation ... eID=153146

Yohara was indeed based in the Emirates, and I actually have access to some of the original promotional material Yohara used in marketing the Dubai development "The Jewel". They were truly able to create a sense of legitimacy with these materials and other marketing gear. If it had actually been built, it would have rivaled the palm in terms of sheer scope and grandeur.

The 'proposed' project was to remake 7 wonders of the world (The Pyramids, the Eiffel Tower, the Statue of Liberty, The Canals of Venice, Petra, the Hanging Gardens of Babylon, and the Taj Mahal) - to scale, in Dubai! If that wasn't enough, they envisioned rebuilding these monuments in recreations of their host cities... So with the Statue of Liberty, for instance, they wanted to recreate a piece of New York, including the Empire State Building, Chrysler Building and Grand Central Station!

For obvious reasons, this wasn't really considered for approval, but it didn't stop Akhtar from selling units in his phony development to investors. When suspicion of this sham got out he was caught at the airport trying to leave the country. I have heard but haven't been able to confirm - he's being held indefinitely. It's funny you mentioned it, but I believe he also had an interest in Italy or Spain.

I apologize for taking up thread space with an irrelevant topic, but thought some of you might find it interesting nonetheless... I'm in no way trying to imply this sort of thing takes place often in Dubai, as anyone who lives there knows crime of any kind is practically nonexistent.

One opinion on the matter I would like to offer to those posting and reading other’s views here, is that this topic is truly one of relativity and perspective... For someone who's originally from Central America, the quality of employment in Dubai may be fantastic. Someone from Ireland may perceive the racism as non-existent. In addition, although Goodbai seems to feel that the UAE’s monarchy conflicts with the interest of being a progressive, forward-thinking government, I am of the growing opinion that democracy is over-rated, and just maybe, more prone to corruption.

As I said in my original post, most of my friends and colleagues working in Dubai say the culture is very superficial, but this opinion comes from those originally from Canada… a place where the divide between the wealthy and the poor is relatively small... in a global sense, nobody is extremely ‘rich’ here. Those whom I know from Canada working in Dubai express views of being treated by locals with a sense of disdain, like they aren’t worth giving the time of day… that is until they learn my friends are heavily connected with Dubai’s major property developers, then it’s a whole different story. I would like to believe that this sort of scenario would not play out well at all anywhere here in Canada. However in Beverly Hills, Monte Carlo and even Dubai, expectations of favored treatment by virtue of one’s perceived superiority may be acceptable, commonplace and therefore overlooked.

Again (as always), one’s perspective should be considered when responding to each other here. What we conclude as poor employment standards, drudgery, racism, elitism and what exactly is liberal depends greatly on who you are and especially where you’re from. I’m sure Dubai is beautiful and since the UAE is very young, will only improve in every respect in the coming years.

Dubaiman

There is indeed discrimination towards certain nationalities. But, what is new about it? There is no perfect country!

Foreign labor used to save most of their income and send them back to their countries. If living expenses are rising and less money is being wired outside, public perceives it as a dilemma! This is absolutely normal because for many decades, people exported their income from the land that was providing to them. This was not fair to UAE. Now, the situation is moving towards an equilibrium. Yes, the pendelum might have been pulled too far, but it will normalize a little bit. Expats should not forget all of the years through which lots of hard currency was chanelled to their countries from here. Even if life is becoming difficult, people are still choosing to stay and live in this land.

UAE is not to be blamed for globalization has finally caught up with this land.

Mahdi

DubaiMan wrote: It's funny you mentioned it, but I believe he also had an interest in Italy or Spain.

Salam DubaiMan:

First of all, thank you for your links and answer... you look like very kind.
Secondly, i am interested in investing in the AE so my main interest is in economic topics.
Thirdly, unfortunately:))), i have a degree in political sciences so... i am used to analyze political situations... you spoke about Italy or Spain in connection with the real estate... well... if i had to use an Italian approach, i should say that, maybe, probably, the AE police should draw attention to money coming from Italy... there might be possible situations of money laundering.
Thank you for your attention... shukran wa inshallah...

Dario

DubaiMan wrote: I am of the growing opinion that democracy is over-rated, and just maybe, more prone to corruption.

Salam:

It is the hot point in this period. Democracy versus monarchy?.

The problem is: who says what democracy is?. Only Israel or the US?. It is not a good situation where only Israel or the US can tell to other countries what the democracy model is.

Another point to consider may be this: we are speaking of Islamic countries. There are Islamic principles to consider.
In Islamic countries there are several models: the AE, Oman, Saudi Arabia, Iran, Syria, the Maghreb countries, some African countries, Indonesia or Pakistan. And it is not possible that an Islamic country is judged useful for democracy only if it has a positive attitude towards Israel. Israel is not the centre of the world.

The last point: what are the elements to judge a political system?. I will consider one of these elements: the social system. Do you think that the US have the best social system?. I do not think so... they have problems...

In the next future, i think, there might be a lot of competition on these aspects...
The game is still in play...

Thank you... inshallah...

Dario

to you f u c king still uneducated who say no one forced you to come here an stay here ..

realize this if all the ppl who are here now didnt come ur ass would still be riding a f u cking camel not knowing you have oil....

so pls stop saying that bullshit.. everything u got everything u have has been giving to you .. u might say " well we paid money for it " but even that f u cking money was given to ur punk ass ..

when the oil is finished an all this fake ass boom of tourisim is over an the buisness industry crashes .. all the expats would leave.. then i would like to see who gonna survives..

i mean there are soo many countries who have more money but there citizens are active in all fields .. from the guy who sweeps the streets to the doctors from the brick layer to the engineers.. so before you say all the expats if they dont like it can leave .. think can ur assss do any of those jobs.. so be f u cking grateful.... that these ppl are here .. an since they are contributing soo much to the society they have a f u ckin right to complain an say what they feel like saying .. they arent slaves..

but anyways i guess u are on ur own cause there aint many locals who think in the same pretext as u most are educated enough to understand the requirment of freedom of speech

Jamal wrote:to all you f u c king still uneducated stupid mother f u c king locals who say no one forced you to come here an stay here ..

realize this if all the ppl who are here now didnt come ur a#s would still be riding a f u cking camel not knowing you have oil....

so pls stop saying that bullshit.. everything u got everything u have has been giving to you .. u might say " well we paid money for it " but even that f u cking money was given to ur punk camel riding asses ..

when the oil is finished an all this fake a#s boom of tourisim is over an the buisness industry crashes .. all the expats would leave.. then i would like to see which f u ckin local survives..

i mean there are soo many countries who have more money then uae but there citizens are active in all fields .. from the guy who sweeps the streets to the doctors from the brick layer to the engineers.. so mother f u cker before you say all the expats if they dont like it can leave .. think can ur assss do any of those jobs.. so be f u cking grateful.... that these ppl are here .. an since they are contributing soo much to the society they have a f u ckin right to complain an say what they feel like saying .. they arent slaves..

so too all the locals who are thinkin in the same pretext as the above local fool ... you all can eat a big fat d i c k... and if u wanna do something about wat i said ... my number is up in the fight club.. give me a f u cking call ...

spoke from ur heart! First time have 2 agree with Jamal. Those ppl toiling here for rs MUST have a right to express and other rights. Just bcos he is sweeping the roads or putting bricks doesnt mean he is worse than me. Immigrants has made most of the Gulf, now it's time for Gulf to give em something.

Jamal wrote:to all you f u c king still uneducated stupid mother f u c king locals who say no one forced you to come here an stay here ..

realize this if all the ppl who are here now didnt come ur a#s would still be riding a f u cking camel not knowing you have oil....

so pls stop saying that bullshit.. everything u got everything u have has been giving to you .. u might say " well we paid money for it " but even that f u cking money was given to ur punk camel riding asses ..

when the oil is finished an all this fake a#s boom of tourisim is over an the buisness industry crashes .. all the expats would leave.. then i would like to see which f u ckin local survives..

i mean there are soo many countries who have more money then uae but there citizens are active in all fields .. from the guy who sweeps the streets to the doctors from the brick layer to the engineers.. so mother f u cker before you say all the expats if they dont like it can leave .. think can ur assss do any of those jobs.. so be f u cking grateful.... that these ppl are here .. an since they are contributing soo much to the society they have a f u ckin right to complain an say what they feel like saying .. they arent slaves..

so too all the locals who are thinkin in the same pretext as the above local fool ... you all can eat a big fat d i c k... and if u wanna do something about wat i said ... my number is up in the fight club.. give me a f u cking call ...

tsk tsk tsk...you poor ass wipe..

are you burning from the inside??

are you poor and feeling mesrable??

is that why you hate locals so much??

tsk tsk tsk....

dude...for real, get a life

where ya from huh??

which shit hole did u crawl out from huh??

man i welcome anybody who wants to come and work and earn a living..
but stop bitching for god's sake.....as locals we have our complaints too but we learn how to LIVE WITH IT...

yes some of what goodbai said was true to a certain extent..

some are racist...but comon racisim is everywhere these days...its bad but what can you do about it?


and whats with all the cursin and swearin???

grow up man wtf?


im tellin you again who ever has a problem with whats goin on in the UAE can leave anytime he wants....bitchin about it wont do any good...DO SOMETHIN ABOUT IT...seriously if you think the economy will crash if you leave...then let me assur you that not you or an other dozen of your kind will affect shit in the UAE...so its ok for you guys to take a hike outta here


from your name i guess ur arabic right??

why did you come here??

why rnt you in your country???
could it be more ''shittier'' than it is here is that why you came to UAE?




look look the bottom line is....why do people come choose the UAE?...


iv asked alot of people from UK and south africa and the US and alot of other Countries,they all agreed that the UAE is a SAFE PLACE TO LIVE IN..


and im sure u havnt been shot in the UAE have yah??

well a SAFE PLACE to raise your family and kids is a pretty much good reason for living here and appreciating the safety that this wonderful country is giving your cheap ass dont'ch you think?

with all do respect and love to those who love and cherish this country as i do...and seriously i love the variety in nationalities in this country...that what makes it such a unique place to live in ^_^

uae_l0co wrote:

Jamal wrote:to all you f u c king still uneducated stupid mother f u c king locals who say no one forced you to come here an stay here ..

realize this if all the ppl who are here now didnt come ur a#s would still be riding a f u cking camel not knowing you have oil....

so pls stop saying that bullshit.. everything u got everything u have has been giving to you .. u might say " well we paid money for it " but even that f u cking money was given to ur punk camel riding asses ..

when the oil is finished an all this fake a#s boom of tourisim is over an the buisness industry crashes .. all the expats would leave.. then i would like to see which f u ckin local survives..

i mean there are soo many countries who have more money then uae but there citizens are active in all fields .. from the guy who sweeps the streets to the doctors from the brick layer to the engineers.. so mother f u cker before you say all the expats if they dont like it can leave .. think can ur assss do any of those jobs.. so be f u cking grateful.... that these ppl are here .. an since they are contributing soo much to the society they have a f u ckin right to complain an say what they feel like saying .. they arent slaves..

so too all the locals who are thinkin in the same pretext as the above local fool ... you all can eat a big fat d i c k... and if u wanna do something about wat i said ... my number is up in the fight club.. give me a f u cking call ...

tsk tsk tsk...you poor a#s wipe..

are you burning from the inside??

are you poor and feeling mesrable??

is that why you hate locals so much??

tsk tsk tsk....

dude...for real, get a life

where ya from huh??

which shit hole did u crawl out from huh??

man i welcome anybody who wants to come and work and earn a living..
but stop bitching for god's sake.....as locals we have our complaints too but we learn how to LIVE WITH IT...

yes some of what goodbai said was true to a certain extent..

some are racist...but comon racisim is everywhere these days...its bad but what can you do about it?


and whats with all the cursin and swearin???

grow up man wtf?


im tellin you again who ever has a problem with whats goin on in the UAE can leave anytime he wants....bitchin about it wont do any good...DO SOMETHIN ABOUT IT...seriously if you think the economy will crash if you leave...then let me assur you that not you or an other dozen of your kind will affect shit in the UAE...so its ok for you guys to take a hike outta here


from your name i guess ur arabic right??

why did you come here??

why rnt you in your country???
could it be more ''shittier'' than it is here is that why you came to UAE?




look look the bottom line is....why do people come choose the UAE?...


iv asked alot of people from UK and south africa and the US and alot of other Countries,they all agreed that the UAE is a SAFE PLACE TO LIVE IN..


and im sure u havnt been shot in the UAE have yah??

well a SAFE PLACE to raise your family and kids is a pretty much good reason for living here and appreciating the safety that this wonderful country is giving your cheap a#s dont'ch you think?

with all do respect and love to those who love and cherish this country as i do...and seriously i love the variety in nationalities in this country...that what makes it such a unique place to live in ^_^

No flamming please. everybody has the right to speak. this is a forum NOT Uae court! provide reason as to y u love ur motherland.Hey Liban can u clean up the $hit?

uae loco man u dont even know where im from
so u pls stop ur bitchin ...

i just got pissed at that guy cause he is giving out the wrong image of this country by saying wat he said ... u gotta have a more educated response then that . i have no hate for the locals cause if i do im hating myself .. just dont like it when one makes all look like a fool..

but yea my post was quite harsh an irrashanal aswell so i got it corrected

peace out vatto locco ... undes madre a todo madre esse.. u feel me carnal