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freza wrote:have I ever said the Bible is perfect? nope.

See - we are in agreement after all!

Which parts of the Bible are imperfect and how can we tell? Is there room for disagreement on this point - and why were the imperfect parts allowed in?

Cheers,
Shafique

hhmm

I didn't hear the answer to the Q: who is more of a brother: a Hebrew to a Hebrew or a Hebrew to an Arab?
interpretation...l o g i c. you have mentioned the word "brethren" before, to explain how Mohammad was the successor of Moses. so I don't see how this can't be easily deduced and answered. ok, the answer is?

freza wrote:wiki also has this:

"Islam permits sexual relations between a male master and his female slave outside of marriage. This is referred to in the Qur'an as ma malakat aymanukum or "what your right hands possess".[60][61]"

shafique wrote:Wiki is wrong on this point - the Quran is categoric about s.ex is only allowed within marriage, and this is also common knowledge.

so Wiki is wrong on this, eh? did you check the numbers on the end of that quote - the reference to this info on wiki? Muslim scholars.
and the
Quran.



{{to be continued on that other place}}

p.s. bring what you've uncovered about what Tabari says on this subject.

freza wrote:I didn't hear the answer to the Q: who is more of a brother: a Hebrew to a Hebrew or a Hebrew to an Arab?

Something doesn't seem right with your question. God was pointing to Hebrews and said their brethren, if it was from among Hebrews than it makes more sense that God would have said "I'll raise a prophet like you (Moses) from them" instead of "their brethren".

In the context of that verse it appears that Hebrews are addressed as whole, analogy if your question would be like asking if shafique is more brother to himself than his sibling

And I don't really understand the point you are making, the verse just says their brethren, it doesn't go like "from those more of their brethren". I don't really see an issue of who is more of a brother.

freza wrote:wiki also has this:

"Islam permits sexual relations between a male master and his female slave outside of marriage. This is referred to in the Qur'an as ma malakat aymanukum or "what your right hands possess".[60][61]"

shafique wrote:Wiki is wrong on this point - the Quran is categoric about s.ex is only allowed within marriage, and this is also common knowledge.

according to islamic scholars, wiki isnt wrong in this.

just depends which scholar you talk to..

shafique i already linked you with you tube links on a massive debate regarding this matter that ended up with the muslim mohajaba presenter, taking off the hijab and dropping islam all together.. because scholars could not answer to her simple question... the same question i asked you

what is god's wisdom in "ma malakat aymanohom"

of course you said that islam doesnt allow this outside of marriage, so i didnt discuss it with you further.... but they dont seem to agree with you.

they say that you are allowed to sleep with "whatever your right hand posesses" without marriage, because you own them. they are yours to keep and to sleep with whenever you want to.



again shafique, when it boils down to 2 scientists from al azhar's word, or yours... nothing against you personally, but unfortunatly with no credentials to your name, i have to take their word for it.

freza wrote:hhmm

I didn't hear the answer to the Q: who is more of a brother: a Hebrew to a Hebrew or a Hebrew to an Arab?
interpretation...l o g i c. you have mentioned the word "brethren" before, to explain how Mohammad was the successor of Moses. so I don't see how this can't be easily deduced and answered. ok, the answer is?

freza wrote:wiki also has this:

"Islam permits sexual relations between a male master and his female slave outside of marriage. This is referred to in the Qur'an as ma malakat aymanukum or "what your right hands possess".[60][61]"

shafique wrote:Wiki is wrong on this point - the Quran is categoric about s.ex is only allowed within marriage, and this is also common knowledge.

so Wiki is wrong on this, eh? did you check the numbers on the end of that quote - the reference to this info on wiki? Muslim scholars.
and the
Quran.



{{to be continued on that other place}}

p.s. bring what you've uncovered about what Tabari says on this subject.

lol half the crap on wiki is bullS"it. yeh Wiki says that sex is allowed with a slave female outside of marriage LOL come on use ur common sense as shaf has said. by the way which Islam are you talking about? the Shias islam? the Ismaelees Islam? the Agha Khani Islam?

y dont u open up the Quran and see what the Quran says about having sex with a slave. by the way i know its in arabic but theres a translation too.

and oh Ebonics dude i really dont care what the scholars or some mulla says. I dont follow them nor do I need them to get through to God. so seriously try getting a quote from the Quran to back ur point otherwise you just waisting everyones time.

nucleus, follow the other forum for more info. but I don't see a point in asking questions if you're refusing to acknowledge the answers.

rudeboy, same to you but just to let you know, I only quoted wikipedia because Shafique quoted from it first and I did so to imply that if he's going to quote from wiki he might as well not overlook all that it says about the issue of slavery and the Quran. btw, did you look up the references? they are Sunni Islamic scholars that support this statement.