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shafique

:) dds - give the young guy credit, he did dig up a thread from 2008 and found two snippets from 7 pages of posts! Now, let's see the young one's interpretation of God's clear explanation: What is your interpretation of 2.62: Those who believe, and those who follow the Jewish (scriptures), and the C...

shafique

Nope, see my edit above - it is your Bible camp theology about Islam that is contradicted by 2.62. All who believe in Allah, last day and do good works' will go to heaven. Can't be clearer than that. And this does not contradict any other verse of the Quran - for these criteria define what faith and...

shafique

Thanks for repeating your belief. But God is quite clear: "Any" - i.e. all who do the following "who believe in Allah (one true God), believe in the day of judgement (i.e. believe they are accountable for actions) AND do good deeds (no explanation needed)' go to heaven. And to remove ...

shafique

God defines in 2.62 what the criteria for 'Submission' are in context of salvation : "Belief in one true God, belief in Day of Judgement and Do Good Works". If you do fulfill these three - you will join the Jews, Christians and Sabians who will be admitted into heaven for doing these. No c...

shafique

Palmer is speaking complete sense when he says the attack by the Israelis on the activists was "excessive and unreasonable". "Israel's decision to board the vessels with such substantial force at a great distance from the blockade zone and with no final warning immediately prior to th...

shafique

Goldstone's conclusions and reasoning were similarly clear. That didn't stop the Israeli's challenging them. If you are arguing that Israeli politicians are as bad as Hamas - well, I think you do have a point. Both are elected officials and both have members with extremist views. Heck, Israel's PM h...

shafique

Begin was a terrorist and was elected. Hamas was elected fair and square in Palestine (overthrowing a corrupt Fatah administration). Hamas abandoned suicide bombing in 2006. Israel regularly bombs and kills Palestinian kids (and holds them hostage in 'administrative detention') - and we all remember...

shafique

Body counts beats spin every time FD. What you and I may think is justified or not doesn't change the numbers of parents who cry over killed children. Administrative detention is nothing more than keeping someone hostage - if they were criminals, they should be charged. To keep children hostage and ...

shafique

Berrin, 2.62 says : Inna, alladhina ammanu : surely/indeed, those who believe wa alladhina hadu: and the Jews wal nasara: and the Christians wal sabina: and the Sabeans man : whoever amana: believes bilahi: in Allah wal yaum il akhri: and the last day wa amila salihan: and does good/righteous deeds ...

shafique

^You're confused young one. Goldstone's conclusions were quite clear - and the ones complaining the loudest were those who supported Israel's brutal bombing campaign. Goldstone was even hounded out of attending his grandson's Bar Mitzvah! But be that as it may, the Palmer report says the Israelis us...

shafique

Mahmoud - This thread is about whether event horizon believes that works (good deeds) are required AS WELL as faith to achieve salvation/entry to heaven. The Bible explicitly says 'faith without deeds is dead' - see OP. Some Christians say that you only need to believe in Jesus as saviour, son of Go...

shafique

An interesting aspect of the 'faith without works' discussion in the separate thread is the question of how Christians themselves treat this verse in respect of other Christians. The most obvious distinction is the rift between protestants and Catholics (and another would between Eastern Orthodox an...

shafique

Please don't overlook this central question eh: Eh - clarify one thing for me: Do you believe that if a person ONLY has faith that Jesus is saviour and that person does NOT do good works, he won't be saved? I've met Christians who say if you have faith you will be saved, regardless of whether you do...

shafique

^Victims being shot multiple times in the back at close range doesn't tie in with the excuse of 'it was self defence - our armed commandos were scared of the activists'

What active imaginations the fanbois have to have!

Cheers,
Shafique

shafique

No, verse 2:217 does not contradict v 2:62. 2:62 says that anyone who believes in Allah, the last day and does good deeds goes to heaven. It includes Jews, Christians and Sabeans. 2:25 uses the same initial words to describe believers and reiterates the same point - that Faith AND Good deeds are req...

shafique

Stop evading the question eh (and your answer is in direct contradiction to 2.25 of the Quran) ;) Have a look at the thread title, then re-read the question: Eh - clarify one thing for me: Do you believe that if a person ONLY has faith that Jesus is saviour and that person does NOT do good works, he...

shafique

The report says that Israel still hasn't given any satisfactory explanation as to why they shot 9 activists dead. I highlighted this bit in red - did you miss it?

Why the selective reading FD? Guilt or embarrassment?

Cheers,
Shafique

shafique

Do you have another reason? I said I agreed with Turkey's challenge to the legality of the blockade - you seem to be ignoring what the report says about the shooting of the 9 activists - stating a belief that it was in self defence, when Palmer says Israel hasn't actually given an adequate explanati...

shafique

Mahmoud - one difference between Muslims and some Christians is exactly over the point of whether we can be guaranteed heaven. Islam says that apart from a selected few - we are all at the mercy of God's judgement on the day of judgement. Some Christians believe that if you just believe in Jesus as ...

shafique

Berrin - at the end of the day it is Allah's decision according to Islam. 2.62 states that those who believe in the one God, believe in the day of judgement and do good works will have no fear from God, nor will they grieve. God starts the verse with 'alladhina amanu' i.e. those who believe. As I sa...

shafique

Being shot in the back, multiple times, at close range.. and Israel can't adequately account for the killings. That's what the report says. Can't see where it says these killings were done in self defence - it says Israel hasn't adequately explained why the activists were killed in this way. Perhaps...

shafique

So, in summary - Palmer's report says Israel can't/won't explain the circumstances where 9 unarmed activists were shot - some in the back - multiple times and at close range. Normal people would condemn these killings. Fanbois choose to invent reasons to excuse the crime. Extremists condoning killin...

shafique

^Well, we'll just have to chalk that up to yet another weird belief you have - alongside talking donkeys, sun stopping and now managing to invent a new meaning for apostate! God is quite clear that apostacy is a crime that is punishable by God in the afterlife. What has that got to do with 2.62? The...

shafique

Eh- I promise to answer your question above AFTER you've answered the question relevant to this thread's topic: Eh - clarify one thing for me: Do you believe that if a person ONLY has faith that Jesus is saviour and that person does NOT do good works, he won't be saved? I've met Christians who say i...

shafique

Young eh - not all Christians and Jews are apostates. Some Christians and Jews are murderers and terrorists (such as Brievik and Goldstein). Your argument is funny and ultimately moot - 2.62 is not talking about apostates (or terrorists etc). Now, re-read my post and explain why you are not answerin...

shafique

Mahmoud - not all Christians believe Jesus to be son of God and part of the Trinity. Historically, the Council of Nicea was called to decide on what the Church should adopt as official doctrine on the nature of Jesus because there were differing views amongst the 'Hellenistic' Christians (as opposed...

shafique

LOL - RC 1, fanbois 0 (in reading and comprehension skills). eh - what part of 'No firearms were found on Mavi Marmara' confused you - and why are you bleating on about a silly propaganda story about the unarmed civilians firing first? Try and stick to facts for a change. Imagining that people agree...

shafique

Unarmed civilians are shot in the back, multiple times, and religious extremists and fanbois make excuses.

Sym - you'll only confuse the fanbois with historical facts. Note FD was trying pathetically to blame the victims, again.

Cheers,
Shafique

shafique

FD - you do realise that everyone sees through your tactic of avoiding the killing of the 9 civilians, don't you? Focusing on Palmer's conclusion that the naval blockade is legal won't change what the report's findings on the killing of the 9 were - i.e. that Israel hasn't been able to explain to Pa...

shafique

FD - click on the link Berrin provided, the quote is from Sanberk and seems to have been cut off when he pasted it across. As for your conclusion in reading the report.. I have to admire your Chutzpah. Pretending that you'd addressed the shooting of the civilians in the back and claiming the report ...

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shafique - Posts

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Re: Palmer Report - Flotilla

Re: For Eh: Faith Without Works - Do You Believe?

Re: For Eh: Faith without Works - do you believe?

Re: Palmer Report - Flotilla

Re: Palmer report - Flotilla

Re: For Shafique: Faith W/out Works

Re: For Eh: Faith without Works - do you believe?

Re: For Shafique: Faith W/out Works

Re: For Eh: Faith Without Works - Do You Believe?

Re: Palmer Report - Flotilla

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