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"This attack on the United States will also be a revenge attack for all the mujahideen... and the weak and oppressed Muslims, for example Baytullah Mehsud and Abu Musaab al-Zarqawi, and all the Muslims and Arabs that have been martyred.

"I will take revenge on their behalf and I really wish that the hearts of the Muslims will be pleased with this attack.

"Islam will spread on the whole world and democracy will be defeated... and the world of Allah will be supreme."

shafique wrote:

shafique wrote:The evidence that the Times Square bombing was in retaliation for illegal U.S. predator drone attacks–and not because “they hate our freedoms” or because of some silly South Park affair–is very strong.

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Mehsud said his group would avenge the killing of Baitullah Mehsud and strike back at Pakistan and the U.S. for the increasing number of drone attacks in the tribal areas along the border with Afghanistan.

So these Islamic extremists did not try to bomb Times Square because “they hate our freedoms” or because of an Islamic prohibition on depicting the Prophet Muhammad, or because the religion of Islam is diabolically evil and commands them to do so. The motivations are largely political, not religious, in nature. Our country has attacked theirs and killed their countrymen.

The bewilderment of some Americans–”why are there so many Muslim terrorists!?”–is mostly a reflection of a deep ignorance of what our government does abroad. It’s not really that hard to understand the simple fact that if we kill hundreds of civilians in another country, some people from that country are going to try to retaliate and kill some of us. As Representative Ron Paul put it: “They don’t come here to attack us because we are rich and we’re free. They come and they attack us because we’re over there [attacking them].”
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The Telegraph reports:

Shah Mehmood Qureshi, Pakistan’s foreign minister, said yesterday that the failed attack could be retaliation for US drone attacks on the Taliban.

“This is retaliation. And you could expect that… let’s not be naive,” he told CBS. “They’re not going to sort of sit and welcome you to sort of eliminate them. They’re going to fight back.”
...
Of course, there will be a concerted effort to downplay the fact that hundreds of Pakistani civilians have been killed in these drone attacks, or that the drone attacks are illegal under international law. Notice how the Telegraph says “drones’ killing of Taliban leaders,” even though far more civilians have been killed than Taliban leaders (a ratio of 50:1 according to Pakistani sources, and 16:1 according to CNN’s national security analyst Peter Bergen).

So, let's see what key words above are:

'evidence' 'very strong'
'let's not be naive'

Ron Paul gets it:
“They don’t come here to attack us because we are rich and we’re free. They come and they attack us because we’re over there [attacking them].”

But eh appears to be living up to this statement.
The bewilderment of some Americans–”why are there so many Muslim terrorists!?”–is mostly a reflection of a deep ignorance of what our government does abroad.


Cheers,
Shafique

And here's a reminder of what was said soon after the McVeigh wanna-be was caught:

"jihad, holy fighting in Allah's course, with full force of numbers and weaponry, is given the utmost importance in Islam....By jihad, Islam is established....By abandoning jihad, may Allah protect us from that, Islam is destroyed, and Muslims go into inferior position, their honor is lost, their lands are stolen, their rule and authority vanish. Jihad is an obligation and duty in Islam on every Muslim."

"...You will see that the Muslim world has just started....Islam is coming to the world, inshallah, Islam will spread on the whole world. And the democracy will be defeated, and so was Communism defeated, and all the others isms and schisms will be defeated, and the word of Allah will be supreme, inshallah. And Muslims are gonna do that. And as Allah says in sura 3, verse 110 [of the Qur'an]..."

event horizon wrote:Err, actually your point was that the bomber was motivated to avenge the deaths of Pakistanis (you tried to spin this as meaning the deaths of any Pakistanis - Muslim, Christian, secular), which you claimed meant his reasons were secular.

The Telegraph reports:

Shah Mehmood Qureshi, Pakistan’s foreign minister, said yesterday that the failed attack could be retaliation for US drone attacks on the Taliban.

“This is retaliation. And you could expect that… let’s not be naive,” he told CBS. “They’re not going to sort of sit and welcome you to sort of eliminate them. They’re going to fight back.”

According to the New York Post, Mr Shahzad witnessed the drone attacks during eight months he recently spent in Pakistan and has told prosecutors that his bomb attempt was supposed to be revenge for the drones’ killing of Taliban leaders.

event horizon wrote:Peace with Islam and Muslims is impossible. The only time Muslims seek peace is when they need to reload.

The reason for the bombing was that the US is killing Pakistani civilians.

Whilst he does express a desire for Islam to conquer the world, the bombing is retaliation for US killings. That's the big thing point and really, the two are unrelated (had the US not killed, there's no evidence he'd have carried out the bombings - except in loonville fantasies where all Muslims are war-mongerers).

Very little coverage is given to the fact that the person who first raised the alarm was also a Muslim. Interesting that - he's always referred to as 'a street vendor' or the like, but the fact he's Muslim isn't really emphasised much. Why shouldn't the acts of that Muslim immigrant not be more representative of Islam's teachings?

Masih intercepted the bomber in the doorway, however, and the bomber self-detonated right outside the crowded hall, spraying many of his explosive vest's arsenal of ball bearings out into the parking lot instead of into the cafeteria.

"The sweeper who was cleaning up here saw someone outside and went towards him," said Nasreen Siddique, a cafeteria worker who was wounded in the head, leg and arm by the blast. "[Masih] told him that he could not come inside because there were girls inside. And then they started arguing. And then we heard a loud blast and all the glass broke."

"Between 300 to 400 girls were sitting in there," said Professor Fateh Muhammad Malik, the rector of the university. "[Pervez Masih] rose above the barriers of caste, creed and sectarian terrorism. Despite being a Christian, he sacrificed his life to save the Muslim girls."

Masih was a member of Pakistan's Christian minority, traditionally one of the poorest communities in the country.

Jacobs, who died in 2006, would not have been surprised to learn that it was two street vendors who first notified police of the suspicious Nissan Pathfinder parked on West 45th Street just off Broadway.

Lance Orton and Duane Jackson, both disabled Vietnam War veterans who were hailed as heroes after their roles in the foiling became clear, have been keeping their "eyes upon the street" for years and—like many of their fellow vendors—have frequently tipped off police to strange and illegal activities.*

Jacobs, who died in 2006, would not have been surprised to learn that it was two street vendors who first notified police of the suspicious Nissan Pathfinder parked on West 45th Street just off Broadway.

Lance Orton and Duane Jackson, both disabled Vietnam War veterans who were hailed as heroes after their roles in the foiling became clear, have been keeping their "eyes upon the street" for years and—like many of their fellow vendors—have frequently tipped off police to strange and illegal activities.*

shafique wrote:Read the thread I just started about 9/11 and the motivations behind that - note the bits which talk about Bin Laden and quote him. Again, the same arguments can be applied there - terrorist acts which also killed Muslims and also are politically motivated, but are confused as 'Islamic' because the terrorists were Muslim.

Aliou Niasse, a street vendor selling framed photographs of New York, said that he was the first to spot the car containing the bomb, which pulled up right in front of his cart on the corner of 45th street and Broadway next to the Marriott hotel.

“I didn’t see the car pull up or notice the driver because I was busy with customers. But when I looked up I saw that smoke appeared to be coming from the car. This would have been around 6.30pm.

“I thought I should call 911, but my English is not very good and I had no credit left on my phone, so I walked over to Lance, who has the T-shirt stall next to mine, and told him. He said we shouldn’t call 911. Immediately he alerted a police officer near by,” said Mr Niasse, who is originally from Senegal and who has been a vendor in Times Square for about eight years.

Duane Jackson, a 58-year-old handbag vendor, said that he noticed the car at around 6.30pm and wondered who had left it there.

shafique wrote:the guy who reported the smoking car to the authorities was a Muslim. Had the car exploded, it is pretty likely that he would have been killed.

shafique wrote:The car was spotted by a Senagalese Muslim street vendor who then went to tell Lance to phone the cops.

shafique wrote:kanelli - the guy who reported the smoking car to the authorities was a Muslim. Had the car exploded, it is pretty likely that he would have been killed.

The point is that the motivation for the attempted bombing was US bombings, and not a desire to kill non-Muslims - or even a desire to spread Islam. It was revenge attempt on US citizens (regardless of religion).