Oslo: "immigrants" Account For 70% Of Domestic Violence

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Oslo: "immigrants" account for 70% of domestic violence Dec 29, 2011
What's interesting is that the cultures that are said to carry out 70% of reported cases of domestic violence in Oslo are ones that do not consume alcohol or celebrate Christmas.

Not sure what cultures they could belong to, but it's interesting to note that immigrants are still a clear minority (but not much longer) yet account for the vast majority of domestic violence cases.

One wonders if there is a certain misogynist attitude amongst these "immigrants" to explain why they would account for the majority of assault rapes (94%) and domestic violence (70%) when they make up only around 20% of the population.

What I found interesting is that reported cases of domestic violence decreased during Ramadan. The domestic violence coordinator interviewed for this story refrained from speculating about any reason.

Perhaps - and I'm just guessing here - because marital rape is allowed in Islam and Muslims are prohibited from s.e.xual intercourse during Ramadan, a good proportion of domestic violence in Muslim families are over bedroom issues. This is not an issue during Ramadan and therefore domestic violence decreases. Ramadan must be one of the greatest months for Muslim wives. It would be interesting to determine if there is a sharp spike in reported cases of domestic violence in the weeks following Ramadan.

Also note the parallel laws mentioned in the article. "Immigrants" do not believe nor respect Norwegian law. "Their" law supersedes that of their adopted homeland. And from the article, it seems there is also an issue of bigamy amongst these immigrant groups.


Domestic violence coordinator Stein Erik Olsen says that families with different ethnic backgrounds dominate the domestic violence statistics.

Newspaper would write an article about julefri, Christmas dinners, Christmas beer, Christmas aquavit and Christmas brawl in Norwegian homes.

The theory was that there is more domestic violence during the Christmas season when people have more free and more alcohol.

Not so in Oslo. Domestic violence coordinator Stein Erik Olsen in Oslo says the Christmas violence is a myth in the same way that there are more burglaries during holidays.

- 70 percent of these cases involve families with different ethnic backgrounds. Cultures, we are talking about using little alcohol and do not celebrate Christmas, says family violence coordinator in Oslo, Stein Erik Olsen to Nettavisen. And adds.

- What we have seen here on Stovner is that the number of cases has gone down during Ramadan, says Olsen.

Why the number of domestic violence cases go down during the Muslim fasting will not speculate Olsen in.

Set the agenda
Soon it will be ten years since the National Police Directorate launched a nationwide focus on family violence. All the country's police received a domestic violence coordinator. It previously had remained with the emergency of domestic violence should now be the start of a police investigation of possible conviction for domestic violence as a result.

In 2005, a penal clause against domestic violence. Penal Code 219 should take over the general provisions relating to violence and intimidation. It also increased the penalty for violence that were committed within the four walls.

Do not aim to decrease
Number of cases that end up in the Oslo District Court shows that the focus is producing results.

Number of domestic violence cases total has increased from 633 cases in 2008 to 932 cases per 1 December 2011.

Figures from the National Police Directorate shows an increase in the number of reviews for the violation of Penal Code 219 on 168 percent from 2007 to 2011.

- Our goal is not to get into these matters. Probably there are many more who need help. Our goal is to identify and combat domestic violence. This means lower numbers that the police are less active, says smaller number means a smaller active police, said Oslo's domestic violence coordinator Stein Erik Olsen. Police chief assistant is chief investigator on the Stovner police station, saying that the capital they feel now that more and more victims even contact the police.

Olsen says that one of the challenges of other cultures is that they have their own laws and another of women than is accepted in the Norwegian society.

- In the worst of our stuff so it's pretty extreme how cultures manage the family, and how there are other laws and regulations than the Norwegian, as applicable. But we have more knowledge about these matters, and it is no longer all women from these cultures that accept it. For many of them are incredibly tough to report. To speak with us, like they have to break with people who are their only evidence in a foreign country, says Olsen.

More confidence in the police
In recent years, more and more people contacted the police to ask for help. Olsen takes this as a signal that people have more confidence in the police, and the dark figures are becoming smaller.

When women see that the police follow up cases of domestic violence, and that society does not accept such violence, it will be more to report, says Olsen.

Kari Naess Rewinding at the crisis center in Fredrikstad supports Olsen that the police have more confidence in this type of case in recent years.

- Today we have a good working relationship with the police. We feel that they are more helpful and that they are currently listening to these people, says Omvik.

But even if society in general is opposed to violence in the home, it is still difficult for victims to understand what happens to them, and break out of violent relationships.


http://www.nettavisen.no/nyheter/article3288967.ece

You can use google translate to read the original article:

http://translate.google.com/

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Re: Oslo: "immigrants" Account For 70% Of Domestic Violence Dec 30, 2011
Interesting, the NYT also ran with an article in October. It didn't spin the problem in the way eh is trying to do, but highlighted the scale of the problem in Norway and how most domestic rapes were not reported. It did highlight that immigrant women were more likely to report - and cited experts explaining why.

Official Police statistics showing the breakdown of those committing se.xual crime shows that the overwhelming majority are Norwegian.



http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/25/world ... wanted=all

One in 10 Norwegian women over the age of 15 has been raped, according to the country's largest shelter organization, the Secretariat of the Shelter Movement. But at least 80 percent of these cases are never brought to official attention and only 10 percent of those that are end in a conviction, the Justice Ministry says.

Nowhere is this taboo more stubborn than in the family home, long considered off-limits for law enforcement and the state.

"The statistics tell us that the safest place for women is outside, on the street — most rapes happen at home," said Tove Smaadahl, general manager of the Shelter Movement. In a 2005 survey by the Norwegian Institute for Urban and Regional Research, 9 percent of female respondents in a relationship reported experiencing sexual assault.

"No, we don't have equality between men and women," Ms. Smaadahl said, "not until we have addressed the issue of relationship rape."


And most of the reported relationship rapes were prosecuted:

These findings challenge widely held notions that partner rape is the most difficult to prosecute. Instead, as chronicled in the 2009 report, prosecution and conviction rates look deeply biased: Forty percent of rapes in which the perpetrator did not know the victim but was successfully identified were prosecuted, with conviction rates of more than 70 percent. By contrast, only 14 percent of suspects in partner rape were convicted. Suspects of immigrant origin were particularly likely to be punished.


But the disproportionate numbers of immigrants who are going to shelters and reporting the crime is explained:

Norwegian women and middle-class women of any background tend to be more embarrassed about being raped and beaten than the growing number of lower-income immigrant women in the shelter because they are expected to be that much more emancipated, psychologists and rape counselors say.


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Re: Oslo: "immigrants" account for 70% of domestic violence Dec 30, 2011
The facts are that non-Nordic Norwegians carry out 70% of reported cases of domestic violence in Oslo - and the numbers of reported cases are expected to rise. :shock:

I note the story you posted is slightly off topic. You can start another thread discussing relationship rape in all of Norway, but this thread is about domestic violence in Oslo. Of which, 70% of the time the crime is carried out by non-Nordic Norwegians even though they account for only twenty percent of Oslo's population.
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Re: Oslo: "immigrants" Account For 70% Of Domestic Violence Dec 30, 2011
The NYT article from October is very much on topic - and exposes your selective spin.

There is a problem with domestic violence in Norway - the majority (80%) of incidents aren't reported, and official police statistics show the breakdown of s.exual crimes reaching the police - the vast, vast majority being Norwegian perpetrators.

As the NYT article indicates - the immigrant communities are more likely to report the crime (I highlighted this for you). Therefore it is only a flight of fancy to imagine that 70% of domestic violence in Norway (or even Oslo) are carried out by immigrants.

80% aren't reported. 1 in 10 Norwegian women above age 15 have suffered rape. Do the math.

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Re: Oslo: "immigrants" account for 70% of domestic violence Dec 30, 2011
There is a problem with domestic violence in Norway - the majority (80%) of incidents aren't reported


Liar. The article is about rape, not domestic violence so it never says 80% of incidents of domestic violence aren't reported.

the vast, vast majority being Norwegian perpetrators.


Children of immigrants and immigrants themselves who have become citizens would be Norwegian.

As the NYT article indicates - the immigrant communities are more likely to report the crime


Liar. The article says Norwegian women are more embarrassed to seek refuge at women's shelters. It says nothing about being more or less likely to report crimes.

(I highlighted this for you)


No you didn't. That's lie #3.

Therefore it is only a flight of fancy to imagine that 70% of domestic violence in Norway (or even Oslo) are carried out by immigrants.


It's a reading comprehension problem on your part. The article in the OP says most domestic violence cases are by non-Norwegian ethnic groups, not specifically immigrants.

You should have read the article as opposed to my headline, genius.

And as my article points out, there's still a barrier present discouraging women of non-Nordic ethnicity from talking to the police and reporting crimes:

But we have more knowledge about these matters, and it is no longer all women from these cultures that accept it. For many of them are incredibly tough to report. To speak with us, like they have to break with people who are their only evidence in a foreign country, says Olsen.


It's also more accepted, as the article points out, in certain ethnic communities in Norway for women to accept domestic abuse and therefore are less likely to report these crimes.
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Re: Oslo: "immigrants" Account For 70% Of Domestic Violence Dec 30, 2011
Again, long waffling post to try and disguise yet another hyped up xenophobic post. The problem of domestic violence includes domestic rape - and, as the NYT reports:
most rapes happen at home


Facts don't seem to sit well with you eh. I guess you didn't do the math as I suggested.

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Re: Oslo: "immigrants" Account For 70% Of Domestic Violence Dec 30, 2011
Again, long waffling post to try and disguise yet another hyped up xenophobic post.




Sorry, do you admit you lied when you claimed 80% of domstic abuse is not reported? If not, which article said that?



Do you disagree, btw, that non-Nordic ethnic minorities account for 70% of domestic abuse cases reported in Oslo?
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Re: Oslo: "immigrants" Account For 70% Of Domestic Violence Dec 30, 2011
Fail. Again.

Most rapes occur in the home. Quote and source given.

Most rapes are by Norwegians. 1 in 10 Norwegian women over age 15 have been raped. 80% of rapes not reported - most of these are domestic rapes.

Look beyond your spin eh - just do the math.

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Re: Oslo: "immigrants" Account For 70% Of Domestic Violence Dec 30, 2011
80% of rapes not reported


You said 80% of domestic violence is not reported. So, do you admit you lied?

Do you disagree with the fact that ethnic minorities (ie., Muslims ?) account for 70% of reported cases of domestic violence?

Why do you suppose cases of domestic violence trend down during Ramadan?
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Re: Oslo: "immigrants" Account For 70% Of Domestic Violence Dec 30, 2011
I totally disagree with your spin - and I gave explicit reasons why you're wrong.

Do you really wish me to repeat my points and sources above?

Which facts that I listed are you in disagreement over - that the 80% doesn't apply to domestic violence and only applies to rapes, of which most are domestic rapes? Why would you think that the 80% doesn't apply? Rapes are quite extreme forms of domestic violence and the 80% non-reporting rate is probably an understatement (the 80% is an estimate by an expert, after all).

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Re: Oslo: "immigrants" Account For 70% Of Domestic Violence Dec 30, 2011
You claimed 80% of domestic violence is not reported. Which expert claims this?

Seems like you have an inability to admit when you're wrong - or were caught up in another lie.
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Re: Oslo: "immigrants" Account For 70% Of Domestic Violence Dec 30, 2011
You keep imagining things that aren't real.

Let's face it, you made a claim that isn't based in reality and is just spin. I've exposed your spin.

But here's the relevant portion of the article (again):

Sexual violence against women in Scandinavia shares characteristics seen in more unequal societies: It is all too common and rarely reported, and those who commit it are even more rarely convicted. Ancient prejudices about male prerogative and modern assumptions about female emancipation conspire to create a thick wall of silence, shame and legal ambiguity.

One in 10 Norwegian women over the age of 15 has been raped, according to the country's largest shelter organization, the Secretariat of the Shelter Movement. But at least 80 percent of these cases are never brought to official attention and only 10 percent of those that are end in a conviction, the Justice Ministry says.

Nowhere is this taboo more stubborn than in the family home, long considered off-limits for law enforcement and the state.

"The statistics tell us that the safest place for women is outside, on the street — most rapes happen at home," said Tove Smaadahl, general manager of the Shelter Movement. In a 2005 survey by the Norwegian Institute for Urban and Regional Research, 9 percent of female respondents in a relationship reported experiencing sexual assault.


Most rapes occur at home - ergo, these are examples of domestic violence. Over 80% rapes not reported. Ergo, unless you believe domestic violence reports that are not rapes are reported more freely than rapes, the unreported figure is again at least 80%.



Ergo - yet another case of spin over reality.

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Re: Oslo: "immigrants" Account For 70% Of Domestic Violence Dec 30, 2011
You keep imagining things that aren't real.


What am I imagining that isn't real? I asked you to find in the article where it said 80% of domestic violence goes unreported.

Where did the article say 80% of domestic violence goes unreported?

I don't care what you imagine.

Seems like you have an inability to admit making a mistake (or when your lies are exposed).
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Re: Oslo: "immigrants" Account For 70% Of Domestic Violence Dec 30, 2011
There you go again - making accusations and trying to deflect away from your exposed spin.

If you want to believe the spin, go ahead. I've explained why the facts disagree with your spin, given you the evidence and even taken the time to explain why I used the 80% figure given.

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Re: Oslo: "immigrants" Account For 70% Of Domestic Violence Dec 30, 2011
You were caught red handed in a lie and you continue to deny being caught.

But seriously, where did the article say 80% of domestic violence goes unreported?

Facts over your imagination.

If you want to believe the spin, go ahead.


Which spin would that be? A figure you made up?

I used the 80% figure given.


Because you're a liar who can only debate using straw-men and outright fabrications?

Btw, which expert in the either article says 80% of domestic violence goes unreported?

I know you say that, but that was after you were caught making that figure up.
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Re: Oslo: "immigrants" Account For 70% Of Domestic Violence Dec 30, 2011
There you go again, waffling on and trying to deflect from your failed spin.

If you think I'm a liar and am wrong on the numbers - give me the correct number according to you and what your source is. I've given you both the source and my reasoning.

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Re: Oslo: "immigrants" account for 70% of domestic violence Dec 30, 2011
from your failed spin.


Such as?

If you think I'm a liar and am wrong on the numbers


That's what I've asked you to do.

You made the numbers up.

You lied and are unable to find one source that says 80% of domestic violence goes unreported. Instead, you took the numbers regarding another crime and claimed this represented domestic violence.

You lied.

Now admit your lie and move on.

I've given you both the source and my reasoning.


In other words, you've lied and are justifying your lie with flimsy reasoning.

For one thing, you lied when claiming the NYT article claimed 80% of domestic violence goes unreported:

shafique wrote:The NYT article from October is very much on topic - and exposes your selective spin.

There is a problem with domestic violence in Norway - the majority (80%) of incidents aren't reported


Now, I want you to find where the article says this or admit you lied.

You're either a compulsive liar or full of hubris and can't admit your mistake.

I feel bad for any person who has to suffer your presence.

What it must be to be around an ego maniac, manipulator, control freak and serial liar.
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Re: Oslo: "immigrants" Account For 70% Of Domestic Violence Dec 31, 2011
Your spin has failed.

Should you come up with a new argument, let me know. Highlight the new material clearly.

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Re: Oslo: "immigrants" account for 70% of domestic violence Dec 31, 2011
Your spin has failed.


I'm still waiting for you to find where the NYT article said 80% of domestic abuse goes unreported.

You did say the NYT article said that. So, where in the article can I find this claim?

Let me know when you want to address the fact that non-Nordic ethnic minorities account for 70% of domestic violence in Oslo.
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Re: Oslo: "immigrants" Account For 70% Of Domestic Violence Jan 01, 2012
Imagining that your spin hasn't failed isn't going to help you eh - you can repeat your selective spin all you like, but the facts remain.

If you do come up with a new argument or some real evidence to back up your claims, please let me know. Until then, you have my previous posts above to refer to.

shafique wrote:If you think I'm a liar and am wrong on the numbers - give me the correct number according to you and what your source is. I've given you both the source and my reasoning.


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Re: Oslo: "immigrants" account for 70% of domestic violence Jan 01, 2012
Imagining that your spin hasn't failed isn't going to help you eh - you can repeat your selective spin all you like, but the facts remain.


What spin would that be - that according to experts, non-Nordic ethnic groups account for 70% of reported cases of domestic violence in Oslo?

If you think I'm a liar and am wrong on the numbers - give me the correct number according to you and what your source is. I've given you both the source and my reasoning.


I'm asking for your source for the figure you imagined. So I guess your argument relies on making figures up. Glad we agree.
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Re: Oslo: "immigrants" Account For 70% Of Domestic Violence Jan 02, 2012
So, no real evidence - just more spin.

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Re: Oslo: "immigrants" Account For 70% Of Domestic Violence Jan 02, 2012
Sorry, are you confused of the fact that non-ethnic Norwegians account for 70% of reported domestic abuse in Oslo?
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