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Ahmadi's under Palestinian rule

The teachings of the moderate Ahmadiyya sect of Islam have been labeled apostasy by Palestinian Authority clerics, leaving its members open to persecution and even threats of murder. PA leaders have refused to step in, saying the status of the Ahmadiyya community is a matter for the courts to decide.

Arutz Sheva's Hebrew news service spoke to Mohammed Sharif Ouda, head of the Ahmadi community in Israel, who discussed the problems facing Ahmadi Muslims in the PA and worldwide.

Ahmadi believers living in PA-controlled areas have been beaten and have had their property destroyed, Ouda added.

There is an Ahmadi community in Gaza as well. "In Gaza," Ouda said, "the death penalty is enforced for various crimes, and members of the Ahmadi community hide their true beliefs."

I condemn how Hamas and the PA treats Ahmadi's.

Do you Shafique, as an Ahmadi, also condemn Hamas and the PA for this and thank Israel for provided a safe haven for them?

Flying Dutchman wrote:
I condemn how Hamas and the PA treats Ahmadi's.

Bravo I condemn that too!

In case Ahmadi's or Flying Dutchies got massacred someday (I hope -atleast- the Flying Dutchies ) then we'll see how you feel when the whole world would watch you and request an investigation on this "assumed" massacres, and let me know how you feel when the NEGOTIATION takes up to 50 years and only 30% of ur species are left

If you pissed off to the max. try to calm down, and never strike back, not even with a water-gun, or fire-works, cuz then you'll be listed as a terrorist Keep negotiating my sweet Duchess

Blimey I didn't know that israelis hands streched out as far as Ahmadi sect to manipulate muslims. There we go..they have another excuse to hostile one religious group into another, just like they created hamas to size fattah movement...
Israelies are just as hell as they have ever been...ar.se.oles

symmetric wrote:In case Ahmadi's or Flying Dutchies got massacred someday

The threat of Ahmadi's being massacred is very real, as we have seen in Pakistan, where the Taliban are slaughtering them. Hamas and Taliban have a lot of common and consider Ahmadi's apostates. And they kill apostates. Ahmadi's under Hamas therefore have to hide their religion, fearing for their lives. In Israel they can freely practice their religion and have an office near Haifa. Ahmadi's are critized for having relations with Israel, by the same people who want to kill them.

The Ahmadis have had a mosque and community in Palestine since before Israel was founded - the mosque in Haifa is in a prominent location on a hill.

Edit - here's a picture, and it says the first mosque there was built in 1931:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kababir

Of course I condemn any religious discrimination and attacks on civilians, regardless on who does them or who is on the receiving end (strange question, did you think I'd change my mind after all the previous times you've asked me about my views on attacks on civilians?)

But interesting you ask me about Hamas' treatment of religious minorities. The link you gave didn't mention Hamas at all. Were you referring to a different report or some other source for your views? I see that there are some Mullahs in Palestine that oppose Ahmadis - but that's hardly news, in 1974 72 Muslim sects declared Ahmadis non-Muslim in a conference in Lahore. The deobandis can't stand the brevlis, the Wahabis get up most people's noses and the Shia-Sunni divide is virulent as ever.

However, if you have a reference for Hamas wanting to kill Ahmadis, please produce it. But I'm struggling to see why that would affect my views on Israel's crimes against Palestinians? (Did you ask eh why he condones Turkish attacks against Kurds and yet doesn't support Turkish criticism of Israel's massacre this week?)

Cheers,
Shafique

So you justify all the killings FD.. since when are you a hamas and Taliban supporter?

Flying Dutchman wrote:

symmetric wrote:In case Ahmadi's or Flying Dutchies got massacred someday

The threat of Ahmadi's being massacred is very real, as we have seen in Pakistan, where the Taliban are slaughtering them. Hamas and Taliban have a lot of common and consider Ahmadi's apostates. And they kill apostates. Ahmadi's under Hamas therefore have to hide their religion, fearing for their lives. In Israel they can freely practice their religion and have an office near Haifa. Ahmadi's are critized for having relations with Israel, by the same people who want to kill them.

Lets negotiate for the coming 50 years & express our sorrow and condemn such acts
Surely, we'll end up in a solution right?

Or else, just shut up Duchess

FD isn't happy - but I'm glad to see that he's found a new interest in the fate of Kurds (although only just one post FD - c'mon, they could do with a bit more support) - and a couple of threads now on the fate of Ahmadi muslims.

Have you run out of steam in the Israeli cheerleading efforts?

Talking about Hamas etc - I stated in the 'Sea of Stupidity' thread that you haven't disagreed with the fact that Israel is breaking international law by annexing Jerusalem - I just wanted to give you the opportunity to correct this statement in case you have now changed your mind, or if I misunderstood your previous quotes on the subject.

Hamas - well, I'll continue to point out where Israeli spin misrepresents them - but as for the flotilla massacre, that's Israel's doing and nothing really to do with Hamas as far as I can see.

But, back to your assertion that Hamas wants to kill Ahmadi Muslims - is this spin, or do you have some figment of evidence for this. To my knowledge Hamas hasn't killed anyone over a religious matter - but perhaps you can correct this if incorrect?

I trust there is some substance behind your accusation - I'd hate to think you'd picked up eh's 'all mouth, no trousers' bad habits!!

Cheers,
Shafique

Now wait FD screaming...noaw noaw Ahmediya isn't political, it is religiooouuuus group...

symmetric wrote:let me know how you feel when the NEGOTIATION takes up to 50 years and only 30% of ur species are left

Palestinian Arabs under Israeli rule have one of the highest population growth numbers in the Middle East, so I donot know where the 30% comes from.

Is that the reason why they have to know how to kill very well to their best capabilities...ar.se oles...

But what about their artifical growth outnumbering indigenous arab population..

For example, between 1922 and 1948 the Jewish population in Palestine grew at an annual average rate of 9 percent. Of this growth, 75 percent was due to immigration. By contrast, in the same period, the Arab population grew at an average annual rate of 2.75 percent--almost all as a result of natural increase. Between 1948 and 1960, immigration still accounted for 69 percent of the annual average growth rate of 8.6 percent. A significant group entering Israel since 1965 has been Soviet Jews, of whom approximately 174,000 immigrated between 1965 and 1986. In the most recent period for which data existed in 1988, the period from 1983 through 1986, immigration contributed only a little more than 6 percent to a much diminished average annual growth rate of 1.5 percent.

http://countrystudies.us/israel/38.htm

Err, did anyone spot where FD answered the question about evidence for Hamas wanting to kill religious minorities? (I might have missed the answer - so help me out guys)

BTW - clerics in occupied Palestine seem to like wishing death and destruction on others - eg. a Rabbi in the West Bank declared it is ok to kill Gentile babies - if Israel was threatened!

West Bank rabbi: Jews can kill Gentiles who threaten Israel
Book by Rabbi Yitzhak Shapiro of Yitzhar permits even the murder of babies and children who pose threat.
http://www.haaretz.com/jewish-world/news/west-bank-rabbi-jews-can-kill-gentiles-who-threaten-israel-1.4496

Of course, the fanbois would rightly jump up and down in indignation if I suggested this was Israeli government policy, but it is ok for them to quote some Imams in occupied Palestine and then say it is the elected government's view. Hmm. (That said, perhaps it is - but we'll have to see the evidence.)

Cheers,
Shafique

Shaffy, your argument is with Mohammed Sharif Ouda, head of the Ahmadi community in Israel.

Flying Dutchman wrote:

symmetric wrote:let me know how you feel when the NEGOTIATION takes up to 50 years and only 30% of ur species are left

Palestinian Arabs under Israeli rule have one of the highest population growth numbers in the Middle East, so I donot know where the 30% comes from.

Forget the numbers Duchess, and focus on the 50 years of massacres
Are we negotiating here or what?

Flying Dutchman wrote:Shaffy, your argument is with Mohammed Sharif Ouda, head of the Ahmadi community in Israel.

Nope, my argument is with you over YOUR assertion that Hamas wants to kill Mr Ouda.

Please look down and let us know whether you have any trousers!

But seriously, I know you're smarting over Israel's fiasco - but c'mon, you didn't really expect me to get angry and miss the fact you haven't given us any evidence for your assertion that Hamas wants to kill Ouda.

(BTW - do you agree/disagree with the Rabbi who says Gentile babies are legitimate targets? Should we 'assume' that Bibi shares this view??)

Cheers,
Shafique

Ouda is safe in Israel. He says Ahmadi's in the Pali territories are threatened and discriminated against by Muslims. If you disagree, argue with him!

Of course I disagree with the rabbi.

I'm glad we both disagree with the Rabbi - and I guess we both would object if we used him to say that Bibi wanted to kill Gentile babies.

So, I come to your assertion that Hamas wants to kill Ouda. I guess that if you had some evidence you would have produced it. The article you linked to did not mention Hamas.

Now, repeat after me...

All Mouth...

No Trousers.




But let me throw you a bone. IF Hamas does indeed condone violence against minorities, then I do indeed condemn this. The clerics that call for the deaths of others are just as bad as Rabbis and Priests who misuse the Bible for this end as well.

Cheers,
Shafique

Before we condemn attacks against Ahmadis/Qadianis, it is important to keep in mind that Ahmadis have links to Zionism.

Qadianiism was established by the British to drive a wedge between Muslims making the act of occupation easier for Europeans.

It was a simple matter of divide and conquer.

event horizon wrote:Before we condemn attacks against Ahmadis/Qadianis, it is important to keep in mind that Ahmadis have links to Zionism.

Qadianiism was established by the British to drive a wedge between Muslims making the act of occupation easier for Europeans.

It was a simple matter of divide and conquer.

Thats at least how Berrin partly justifies the slaughtering of Ahmadis by the Taliban.

As long as you share an intense hatred against Israel you are buddies, even the other thinks its ok to kill you because of your religious beliefs.

Hatred makes also blind. Its extermely sad, but thats how it is.

event horizon wrote:Qadianiism was established by the British to drive a wedge between Muslims making the act of occupation easier for Europeans.

Dude your usually forgiven for being a dumbass being a troll and all. The brits were in and occupied India centuries before the sect's founder was even born infact less than 50 years after his death they left giving it independence.

Troll, your getting sloppy !

symmetric wrote:

Flying Dutchman wrote:

symmetric wrote:let me know how you feel when the NEGOTIATION takes up to 50 years and only 30% of ur species are left

Palestinian Arabs under Israeli rule have one of the highest population growth numbers in the Middle East, so I donot know where the 30% comes from.

Forget the numbers Duchess, and focus on the 50 years of massacres
Are we negotiating here or what?

If you keep saying Duchess (its DuTchess), I am going to label you Emira-ieww

...Dutchess from now on aight?

desertdudeshj wrote: Dude your usually forgiven for being a dumbass being a troll and all. The brits were in and occupied India centuries before the sect's founder was even born infact less than 50 years after his death they left giving it independence.

Troll, your getting sloppy !

Agreed:

Berrin wrote:Taliban knows that there was no such thing as Ahmadi sect in islam and that this sect was formulated by the British agents to bread hatred amongst loyal sunni muslims

Well to sidetrack. It is pretty shitty, specially countries like pakistan blame anything everything on Jews Israel, America and India. And that pretty much the view the general public there have aswell.

Why are the roads dirty. Its the Jews. How come there's no electricity ? America did it ! Why are all govt officals corrupt ? Israel is replacing them with corrupt clones ?

For F*cks sake, admit and stand up to your own problems. If you don't see a problem how you going to find a solution !

* Rant over, back to regular programing