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I think that the US unequivocally stating that it will veto any security council resolution for a Palestine state has severely damaged its credibility as an impartial broker. Even prior to this there were concerns (and rightfully so) that the US was biased but now after its veto threat in the face of almost unanimous support globally for a Palestinian state I think there is no going back for the US.

I attach a link which I found where a lady from the Institute of Policy Studies discusses the US's role in Israel and the protection it has afforded them which has ultimately allowed to continue their occupation and human rights abuses. Some of you may already know this but for me it was eye opener --- $3b in arms annually supplied by US taxpayers. How can the world just turn a blind eye to all of this and how can the US ever be a peace broker?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jw9cv2RK ... re=related

And then they wonder why there is growing anti American sentiment in the Arab and Muslim world and even outside and this will further increase it.

I seriosuly wonder sometimes what Israel has got on the US that it can make it dance at the drop of its hat. Saudi has already issued statements that a veto will seriously effect their alliance and if this does happen I see many more issue such statments. Effectively without the support from the GCC countires it cannot carry on its "War On Terror" in Afghanistan and Iraq.

SO it better think hard and long if Israel means so much to it. On a slightly different note I really dont see any benefit to the US from its alliance with Israel. Maybe during the early days it was an asset in the region but as it stands. The US already has a large military presence in the area, is on good terms with most in the region and its alliance has become more of a liability than an asset. Just baffles me to no end to be honest.

As for being a preace broker currently that sounds like a farce at best while being engaged in two of the bloodiest wars of the century and then stubbing any peacefull and diplomatic solution to the conflict i.e just as guilty toward the palestenian conflict and tragedy as Israel itself.

desertdudeshj wrote:And then they wonder why there is growing anti American sentiment in the Arab and Muslim world and even outside and this will further increase it.

I seriosuly wonder sometimes what Israel has got on the US that it can make it dance at the drop of its hat. Saudi has already issued statements that a veto will seriously effect their alliance and if this does happen I see many more issue such statments. Effectively without the support from the GCC countires it cannot carry on its "War On Terror" in Afghanistan and Iraq.

SO it better think hard and long if Israel means so much to it. On a slightly different note I really dont see any benefit to the US from its alliance with Israel. Maybe during the early days it was an asset in the region but as it stands. The US already has a large military presence in the area, is on good terms with most in the region and its alliance has become more of a liability than an asset. Just baffles me to no end to be honest.

As for being a preace broker currently that sounds like a farce at best while being engaged in two of the bloodiest wars of the century and then stubbing any peacefull and diplomatic solution to the conflict i.e just as guilty toward the palestenian conflict and tragedy as Israel itself.

Bloodiest wars of the century. We're only 11 years into the century with another 89 years to go dude!!!! Don't you think that during the remainder of the century other countries may go to war?? Iran is itching for a fight. Israel is begging for a fight, one that would put the US smack in the middle and they would have to consider if losing good relations with Middle Eastern countries is worth saving Israel. Who is to say that war won't break out between two or more countries in the Middle East?? You might want to factor in the number of lives lost and will continue to be lost in Syria, Yemen, Libya, Bahrain, which the US has nothing to do with.

I think if the US continues to protect, support and prop up Israel, it would serve the US interests if they lost their allies as a result. It wouldn't mean that they went from ally to enemy, it's just that the US will be cut out of the picture in the Middle East and then the Middle East, and would love to see it happen with Pakistan and Afghanistan, they will have to deal with their own internal problems and in the event of a war with another country, do without the aid of the US military. I'm all for that!!!!

^That's an impressive bit of whataboutery there Bora - you've forecasted that there will be bloodier wars in the future that the US will not be involved in to dismiss a current statement of fact.

Nice one. Perhaps your prediction will come true. I suspect that there will be bloodier wars, but the US will be involved in them. Let's see.

But can the US be a credible M/E peacebroker - no, I don't think they can any more. You're arguing that it is in the US interest to continue to back Israel - that may well be the case, but that isn't the same as being a peacebroker.

It will be interesting to see how this plays out - especially in terms of what will happen when China becomes top dog again.

Cheers,
Shafique

The US foregin policy is being controlled by the Jewish lobby, and extreme politicians who looks non-conservative, but surely serving their religious political beliefs with full passion. What makes them any different than Al Qaeda anyways?? The only danger targeting the Middle East region is the US politicians who are fooling the American people, with all the misleading media which is again controlled by the Jewish lobby, and then we also got the Shia regimes controlling Iran, now Iraq, and also Lebanon they all cause us more problems and to us, they're serving their own political religious agenda, just like those Jews.

With the current changes, I just hope that soon will rise up decent leaders to clean the area from all this dirt.

shafique wrote:^That's an impressive bit of whataboutery there Bora - you've forecasted that there will be bloodier wars in the future that the US will not be involved in to dismiss a current statement of fact.

Nice one. Perhaps your prediction will come true. I suspect that there will be bloodier wars, but the US will be involved in them. Let's see.

But can the US be a credible M/E peacebroker - no, I don't think they can any more. You're arguing that it is in the US interest to continue to back Israel - that may well be the case, but that isn't the same as being a peacebroker.

It will be interesting to see how this plays out - especially in terms of what will happen when China becomes top dog again.

Cheers,

Shafique

Hello??? Where did I say it is in the interest of the US to continue to back Israel?? Having a dsylectic moment?

Where did I "forecast"?? Is forecast the same as a possibility? I thought forecasts had to do with finance and weather? Who knows what the future holds - except you of course. What "prediction" did I make? I leave predictions to the Mad Wizard Shaf.

Possibilities are just that - possibilities. Not forecasts, not predictions.

As for current statement of fact: the statement claimed that they were two of the bloodiest wars in this century. How can one make that claim when there is still 89 years to go to reach a century? Would have been better to say "to date during this century", don't you think?? unless someone knows something the rest of the world doesn't. Are you now using the word "suspect" in place of "prediction"? How can you possible predict what can happen over the next 89 years, especially since you won't be around to find out if your prediction was correct.

And no to the US being a peacebroker as I think the US lost its credibility as such, along with its credibility in other areas of the world. Hopefully we will have a government that realizes that America comes first and can learn some restraint and stay neutral. (I can dream, can't I???)

All that - and yet in the end we agree that the US having lost its credibility can't be a peacebroker! How much will you write when we disagree!

Cheers,
Shafique

shafique wrote:;)

All that - and yet in the end we agree that the US having lost its credibility can't be a peacebroker! How much will you write when we disagree!

Cheers,
Shafique

If you read my earlier post CORRECTLY everything that followed would have been avoided. Excuse me for pointing out where you twisted my words and were totally wrong in several ways.

Thank you for the correction then.

I'm glad we agree on the main point.

Cheers,
Shafique

You need to stop hanging around with windbag less ! Its constantly getting harder to seperate the fluff from the stuff that matters. You make valid points and arguments, but it is a pain to shift through all the fluff to get to them.

Thank you.

I think BB does make valid points and arguments on this thread and others. Not much fluff if you ask me.