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shafique wrote:I'm happy for you that you think I've admited to trolling in the other thread. It seems quite important to you to think this - so I'm happy to have helped you out.

I have to admit I was quite impressed. It's not often that you admit you're wrong.

--- Fri Jan 27, 2012 12:59 pm ---

shafique wrote:As for the Jersusalem Post photo of German far-right marchers - as I said, don't worry about 'not getting it' BM -

Have no fear, I'm not losing any sleep over it.

I'm so glad you're happy - and if all it takes is for me not to mention facts to you, then so be it.

But can we now return to the topic at hand - how 90% of attacks against Jews in Germany are by right wingers - like the the EDL in the UK. Shocking statistic that isn't it - almost makes one ashamed to be a right-wing supporter if one was that way inclined, don't you agree? (You do know that the EDL are right wing don't you - I mean, with some people thinking Hitler was left wing, you never know... )

Cheers,

Shafique

shafique wrote:But can we now return to the topic at hand - how 90% of attacks against Jews in Germany are by right wingers - like the the EDL in the UK

A huge percentage of attacks against Jews in Britain are carried out by Muslims who share your Antisemitic views.

But that's logical, after all, since 2 out of 5 Muslims view British Jews as "legitimate" targets:

A Jewish charity which monitors acts of anti-Semitism in the UK says it recorded 639 incidents of violence, threats and abuse last year. The figure, from the Community Security Trust, is the second highest since it began its work in 1984.

The peak of 926 incidents came in 2009, and was attributed to a backlash against Israel's invasion of Gaza. Most of last year's incidents happened near Jewish communities in London, Manchester, Hertfordshire and Leeds.

In its annual report, the charity said anti-Semitism had increased since the 1990s and, although said the total number of incidents for 2010 was almost a third less than the 926 recorded in 2009, that was still worse than 2008.
. . .
The CST said that where it had established something of the perpetrator's identity, 47% were white, 29% were Asian, 10% were Arab, 7% were black and 6% were Eastern European.[12]

Nearly two fifths (37 per cent) [of Muslims] believe that the Jewish community in Britain is a legitimate target “as part of the ongoing struggle for justice in the Middle East”. Moreover, only 52 per cent think that the state of Israel has the right to exist, with 30 per cent disagreeing, a big minority. One in six of all Muslims questioned thinks suicide bombings can sometimes be justified in Israel, though many fewer (7 per cent) say the same about Britain. This is broadly comparable to the number justifying suicide attacks in ICM and YouGov polls of British Muslims after the July 7 attacks

Thanks for the quotes and your opinions eh.

Rather than your usual whataboutery arguments, I was expecting (or rather hoping) for a discussion on the finding in the OP- that it is your right wing friends who are carrying out 90% of the anti-semitic attacks in Germany.

I guess you have no comment, other than to repeat your beliefs about Muslims. That speaks volumes.

Facts, not unreferenced hype.

Cheers,
Shafique

shafique wrote:Rather than your usual whataboutery arguments,

he was setting you straight, buster:

shafique wrote:But can we now return to the topic at hand - how 90% of attacks against Jews in Germany are by right wingers - like the the EDL in the UK.

Intersting interpretation of eh's whataboutery. Thank you for that.

For me, it looked very much like the usual denial of facts and reliance on snippets. But that's just me - I'm sure eh appreciates the mutual support you are showing him.

I'd much rather discuss the findings highlighted in the OP and explore why the right wing in Germany are responsible for 90% of anti-Semitic attacks. Rather inconvenient if you want to believe that Mooslims are the main cause of anti-semitism in Europe, I know - but hey, the OP is about this fact.

Cheers,

Shafique

shafique wrote:I'd much rather discuss the findings highlighted in the OP and explore why the right wing in Germany are responsible for 90% of anti-Semitic attacks. Rather inconvenient if you want to believe that Mooslims are the main cause of anti-semitism in Europe

So what is it? It seems you think you are the only one allowed to go outside of Germany. And you donot really focus on antisemitism, but on antisemitic attacks. Event horizon made some very good points about antisemitism in Europe, which you can only counter with very limited vocabulary, like fail, fail, fail. Replies that are not really thought through.

I'd like to discuss the new findings from the German study and explore why it is the far-right, who only number 26,000, in Germany who are carrying out 90% of the anti-semitic attacks there - hence the thread title and the information in the OP.

It is valid to point out that headlines in previous reports don't bring out this stark fact that it is the right-wingers who are carrying out anti-Semitic attacks. We can, of course, compare other reports about anti-Semitism in Germany and see what these new results show.

However, snippets from older reports from Israel aren't really advancing the discussion and seem to be just a 'whataboutery' argument from a right-wing believer in Islamophobic myths. Had eh addressed the report from Germany, it would have been another matter - but he hasn't.

Cheers,

Shafique

I think, the more east you go in Europe, the more Muslim antisemitism is replaced by neo-nazi antisemitism. It wouldn't surprise me at all if most antisemitic crimes in Germany comes from Ossies.

Muslims only do make up less than 5% of Western Europe's population. But even then, they carry out more than their "fair share" of antisemitic attacks in all of Western Europe.

Then we hear arguments that the other 95 percenters supposedly carry out more antisemitic attacks against Jews than Muslims - which isn't true according to the original article I posted.

Apparently such news that a majority carry out a majority of attacks is supposed to come as a shock or something.

I thought the shock is that a small minority population is wreaking havoc (and are unwanted) in all of Western Europe but disproportionately target Jews in particular - often by a factor of ten compared to their absolute population.

The facts are in for antisemitism in Europe. Muslims are far more antisemitics - like our resident Jew hater and religious nutter - than the native Europeans who do not particularly care for their recent neighbors:

The Flemish-language newspaper De Morgen (link only in Flemish) has a major [May 12, 2011] article about a survey of Muslim students in Brussels high schools. The professor who conducted the survey concludes that half "can be described as antisemitic which is a very high rate.'' Five times higher, in fact, then among Flemish-speaking Belgians, who historically have been relatively anti-Jewish.Incidentally, what was being measured here was not antagonism toward Israel but traditional anti-Jewish stereotypes. No doubt, the former attitude is even stronger.

The anti-Jewish sentiments among Muslims don't vary depending on education level or living standards. Obviously, they aren't getting it from Belgian society.

"The antisemitism is theologically inspired," says the sociologist, Professor Mark Elchardus. "There is a direct link between being Muslim and antisemitic feelings...

http://www.webcitation.org/query?url=http://www.rightsidenews.com/2011051713549/editorial/world-opinion-and-editorial/belgium-half-of-all-muslim-immigrant-children-are-antisemitic.html&date=2011-05-19

************************************************

The results suggest that antisemitic views and ambivalent attitudes toward Jews are more common among Muslim Swedes than among Christian Swedes and non-religious Swedes. Among adults 39 percent of Muslim Swedes have a systematically negative view of Jews compared to 5 percent among the rest.

http://icevikings.blogspot.com/2006/10/ ... uslim.html

************************************************



Nearly two fifths (37 per cent) [of Muslims] believe that the Jewish community in Britain is a legitimate target "as part of the ongoing struggle for justice in the Middle East". Moreover, only 52 per cent think that the state of Israel has the right to exist, with 30 per cent disagreeing, a big minority. One in six of all Muslims questioned thinks suicide bombings can sometimes be justified in Israel, though many fewer (7 per cent) say [say suicide bomging is justified] the same about Britain. This is broadly comparable to the number justifying suicide attacks in ICM and YouGov polls of British Muslims after the July 7 attacks.


Btw, how many non-Muslim Brits support suicide bombing their own nation? Anyone want to argue that among any religious group beside Muslims that it's anywhere near 7%?

http://iris.org.il/blog/archives/1040-T ... arget.html



Of course, all these polls shafique will try desperately to spin (but never spins his own sources for some reason - at leat not in the direction that they should not be believed) supports and confirms the previous report discussed in the article I posted from page 1:

Most violent attacks in Western Europe came from people of Arab or Muslim heritage, the report found.

So, even the anti-Jewish attacks in Germany by the far right is not enough to offset Muslim Jew hatred in Europe as a whole.

But it does speak to the numbers that despite such an overwhelming majority of anti-Jew attacks in one large nation (probably mostly in East Germany where antisemitism and Neo-Nazism is a problem unlike the Western portion), Muslims, the less than five percenters, still carry out so many attacks in other countries compared to other groups that they lead Jew attacks in all of Europe.

So, what do your blogger friends have to say about the fact that 90% of anti-semitic attacks in Germany are by right-wingers who share your political views?

All this spiel about 'Muslim hatred' of Jews etc doesn't address this specific fact does it?

Smoke and Mirrors are just a sign of your desperation eh. Sad that.

Cheers,

Shafique

I believe they say these attacks must be relatively insignificant in number if they do not offset the majority of Antisemitic attacks carried out by Muslims in Western Europe.

You believe? On what are you basing this belief, good sir?

You seem to be implying that the numbers or severity of the attacks by your fellow right-wingers aren't numerous/serious. Is there any evidence for this you can provide? Hard numbers/evidence please - not conjecture.

Thanks.

Cheers,
Shafique

Thanks for the snippet from the Israeli report from a few years back, again.

The question was what you are basing your beliefs about the 90% of anti-semitic attacks in Germany by your fellow right-wingers on. Tell me it isn't just this snippet and your hatred of Muslims.

Cheers,

Shafique

What part of the following explanation do you not understand?

I believe they say these attacks must be relatively insignificant in number if they do not offset the majority of Antisemitic attacks carried out by Muslims in Western Europe.

event horizon wrote:What part of the following explanation do you not understand?

I understood your belief the first time time you posted it.

event horizon wrote:I believe they say these attacks must be relatively insignificant in number if they do not offset the majority of Antisemitic attacks carried out by Muslims in Western Europe.

I merely asked where this belief stems from - surely it is not just an extravagant extrapolation from a snippet?

shafique wrote:You believe? On what are you basing this belief, good sir?

You seem to be implying that the numbers or severity of the attacks by your fellow right-wingers aren't numerous/serious. Is there any evidence for this you can provide? Hard numbers/evidence please - not conjecture.

You're quite slow on the uptake these past few months? Is everything alright?

I hope I don't have to repeat the question again.

Cheers,

Shafique

See the report yourself. The "snippet" is one of the report's conclusions. You know, like the title of this thread is a conclusion of a supposed report in Germany where you have not bothered to provide the hard numbers.

So are you saying that the snippet from the Israeli report over a year ago is what you are basing your belief on?

Why not base it on the statistics of the actual attacks carried out by your fellow right-wingers in Germany? Are you afraid that if you look at the facts of the 90% of anti-semitic attacks you will find that they are NOT "insignificant in number" or severity?

Your belief can easily be checked by looking at the numbers. The fact you haven't actually done so speaks more to your prejudices than to reality.

Cheers,

Shafique

Are you saying the snippet from the German report are what you are basing your belief on?

Why not base it on the statistics of the actual attacks carried out by your fellow Muslims in Western Europe?

Are you afraid that if you lookat the facts of teh majority of Antisemitic attacks you will find that they are NOT "insignificant in number" or severity?

Your belief can easily be checked by looking at the numbers. The fact you haven't actually done so speaks more to your prejudices than to reality.

What belief would that be eh?

The fact that 90% of Anti-semitic attacks in Germany are carried out by your fellow right-wingers is not a belief, but a fact.

Try and keep up.



Mistaking facts for beliefs and vice versa seems to be at the root of much of your confusion and fringe beliefs (Hitler was left wing, donkeys can talk etc etc)

Cheers,

Shafique