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Bora Bora wrote:It's nice to see that you think you know me. I'm not talking about the usual child behavior/interaction Kanelli. You know, the kind you and I and everyone else who was a baby/child went through. (Please don't tell me that your children are exempt!) I'm talking about the behavior that parents have control over. What I think and what I know are two different things. I know because I was a hands on parent who believed in the adage: children should be seen and not heard - when it is warranted. There is a time and a place for children.

I bet you are the kind of parent that when sitting down with a friend or having a chat on the phone constantly interrupts your conversation because your child is demanding your attention, which of course, you need to give. I have friends who do that and I tell them to call me when they have time to give me their full attention because I really don't want to have stop and go conversations and listening to mother cater to her little one at the other end of the line. What could be a 10 minute conversation turns into 30 minutes, 20 minutes of me being on "hold".

Yes we will have to agree to disagree. My outlook hasn't always been this way it only developed because there are way too many perfect parents who have perfect children. My contempt isn't towards the children it's towards the parents for being too lazy to parent and think that people like me are visitors to the world that their children own.

Thank you for all your enlightening information. Oh, where were you when I was a parent??? Congratulations on another area that you seem to think you are an expert and excel at perfection. It must be hard being you - being perfect at everything living in an imperfect world.

Yes, there is a time and place for children, and that includes on airplanes where parents obtained tickets just like everyone else.

I have never claimed that I am perfect, but I'm flattered that you seem hold me in such high esteem BB.

uaekid wrote:who can actually relate to your nonsense bora ? you don't want kids to fly bcz they are not to your liking ? airplanes are a public transport , you do know public means everyone is entitled to use it .

just like this public forum, we cant help it your husband not giving you much attentions and its causing us your non stop insanity and being consistently an annoying talkative woman who can't differentiate between women gossip and real discussions .

now I won't be surprised if the next thing you'll suggest is that people should only be driving only color of your choice .. seriously , what are you suggesting here ? "parents with crying babies should not be allowed to fly or should parents puts their kids on mute ? I'll tell you what, why don't you make a daily radio announcement of your next public appearance so that the hall world will lock their kids in house for your majesty to feel conformable.

parents can't help it their kids are bored being restrained in one place doing nothing but setting, its not what they are used too in their daily routines .. unlike you , they are active and energetic. parents can't also help it their kids being sick or scared from the unusual surrounding .

Ah the below the belt cheap shots from the Kid. What else is new? You call taking cheap shots "discussions". The only sensible thing you said in your post is in the last paragragh after all the crap that flowed out of your mouth towards me. But I guess that's you being at your intellectual best.

When did airplanes become "public"? They are not malls or parks Kid. Airplanes are there for people who PAY to use them.

Parents need to take control over their child/ren rather than let them run amuck on a plane and not allow them to disturb other passengers. I don't think you get it because your kids are probably back in economy with the housemaid while you are up front in business (or maybe even first - the farther away the better?) - so as to enjoy the comfort afforded business class.

I'm talking about the children that are left to run amuck and disturb other passengers. I get that children suffer from the pressure in the planes and do expect them to react to it on departure and landing. Yes, children do become ill, as do adults. It's the children that are left to do as they please by parents who don't get it.

Do I want a parent to put a harness on the back of my chair for their little one to bounce around in? Do I want to be told to put my chair up because it doesn't give enough room for the mother with the child in her lap? Do I want a child pulling on the back of my chair? Do I want a child kicking the back of my chair? Do I want a child bouncing off me when I'm sleeping because that child is releasing his/her energy running up and down the aisle? Answer: No to all of the above!!! Fortunately travelling in business helps me to avoid it, but what about those who don't travel business, but travel economy?

Because a child gets fussy, why should it fall to me to "entertain" that child? I don't carry toys in my luggage so that I can distract or pacify the fussy child. Fussy children are no better or worse than the drunk or the talkative passenger sitting next to you, who everyone agrees can be a very annoying individual.

What is wrong with a parent/child section in the airplane? This would accommodate everyone. People who have issues with noisy, misbehaving children and parents who are offended by people like me who don't appreciate having to tolerate their children. I think it's a fair balance. Once again, the world does not belong to children, they are part of it, along with everyone else.

-- Sat Jul 02, 2011 12:15 pm --

kanelli wrote:I have never claimed that I am perfect, but I'm flattered that you seem hold me in such high esteem BB.

Kanelli, I'm sure you are familiar with the term "overrated"? I guess the sarcasm get's lost on you.

-- Sat Jul 02, 2011 12:20 pm --

Chocoholic wrote:Why don't airlines have family sections onboard? I don't think anyone would suggest that children can't or shouldn't fly, but why can't there be a designated area for them? Not sure why no one has ever thought about it to be honest.

Maybe because there will be some screaming over some discrimination? "Why should I have to go to the back of the bus???"

A designated area would clearly provide for everyone: fill parental and child needs, and those without children their expectations.

Bora gets my vote. I would sit as far away as possible from young children on a flight.

Bora Bora wrote:Do I want a parent to put a harness on the back of my chair for their little one to bounce around in? Do I want to be told to put my chair up because it doesn't give enough room for the mother with the child in her lap? Do I want a child pulling on the back of my chair? Do I want a child kicking the back of my chair? Do I want a child bouncing off me when I'm sleeping because that child is releasing his/her energy running up and down the aisle? Answer: No to all of the above!!! Fortunately travelling in business helps me to avoid it, but what about those who don't travel business, but travel economy?

Because a child gets fussy, why should it fall to me to "entertain" that child? I don't carry toys in my luggage so that I can distract or pacify the fussy child. Fussy children are no better or worse than the drunk or the talkative passenger sitting next to you, who everyone agrees can be a very annoying individual.

What is wrong with a parent/child section in the airplane? This would accommodate everyone. People who have issues with noisy, misbehaving children and parents who are offended by people like me who don't appreciate having to tolerate their children. I think it's a fair balance. Once again, the world does not belong to children, they are part of it, along with everyone else.

I've had to fetch my own kid of the aisle sometimes too on the long haul flights where he just couldn't stand sitting still for so many hours. It just isn't safe to be in the aisles when the plane can suddenly drop hundreds or thousands of feet if hitting a wind shear pocket. Do I feel like a bad parent or person because my kid ran off and I had to run down the aisle after him, even if it annoyed anyone to have a kid running loose - no... all I can do is get him back to his seat and minimize disruption to others. In the aisles the flight attendants are going past with trolleys and people are squeezing past to go to and from the bathroom, fat people, drunk people, sleepy people bounce of others' seats too, so children are only one of the many possible annoyances for those sitting in aisle seats. If I paid for a seat and someone had the nerve to put a baby bouncer on it, or tell me that I can't recline it, I'd remind them I paid for my seat and they paid for theirs, and we each have the freedom to do what we like with the seats we paid for.

As for fussy kids, what is your solution? Beat them, gag them, drug them up with valium, stick them in cargo? No one says you have to bring toys or entertain others' kids if you don't want to. I've seen some people play with others' kids for a few minutes and it did wonders to stop the child from fussing. It isn't obligatory, but it can help!

I think a family section would be just fine. In the meantime, buying noise-cancelling earphones is also a good idea (and don't book aisle seats or seats next to baby bassinets!)

Stick'em in the cargo bay.

kanelli wrote:I've had to fetch my own kid of the aisle sometimes too on the long haul flights where he just couldn't stand sitting still for so many hours. It just isn't safe to be in the aisles when the plane can suddenly drop hundreds or thousands of feet if hitting a wind shear pocket. Do I feel like a bad parent or person because my kid ran off and I had to run down the aisle after him, even if it annoyed anyone to have a kid running loose - no... all I can do is get him back to his seat and minimize disruption to others. In the aisles the flight attendants are going past with trolleys and people are squeezing past to go to and from the bathroom, fat people, drunk people, sleepy people bounce of others' seats too, so children are only one of the many possible annoyances for those sitting in aisle seats. If I paid for a seat and someone had the nerve to put a baby bouncer on it, or tell me that I can't recline it, I'd remind them I paid for my seat and they paid for theirs, and we each have the freedom to do what we like with the seats we paid for.

As for fussy kids, what is your solution? Beat them, gag them, drug them up with valium, stick them in cargo? No one says you have to bring toys or entertain others' kids if you don't want to. I've seen some people play with others' kids for a few minutes and it did wonders to stop the child from fussing. It isn't obligatory, but it can help!

I think a family section would be just fine. In the meantime, buying noise-cancelling earphones is also a good idea (and don't book aisle seats or seats next to baby bassinets!)

Not ALL parents go after their children who are running up and down the aisles Kanelli. You can't assume that everyone else may be as aware as you are, because they aren't.

As you say we pay for our seats - aisle or not!!! As for "freedom" to do as one pleases, why should my "freedom", or right as a passenger, to have a trip as comfortable as possible, be diminished by those who think that their child/ren should be "free" to do as they please. I already pay considerably more money to move up a class in the hope that I can have a comfortable flight!!! What are the parents doing for me???

I prefer an aisle seat, or do I have to limit myself??? As I said, I travel business. The frustrations that people experience are generally in economy. Sitting near a baby bassinet isn't always a choice Kanelli, or didn't you know that?? If anyone is aware of the discomfort they would experience sitting there would actually request those seats is beyond me!!! other than being closer to the door to exit, which isn't really a time saver. Those seats and those nearby are probably rejected by most who book early and are left to the few who don't get a choice because of late booking?? When I did travel in economy I learned after a few trips to book further back - AWAY from the child section. Those front rows allowed for a bit of extra leg room, something I needed, but gave up on that area and went for aisle seats further back as that allowed me a bit of space to leg stretch. Choice of aisle seat: it was a choice of being bothered by the person/people sitting near me getting up or being curled up off the aisle; aisle was a better choice. People do bounce around in the aisle - it's due to turbulence - which is something no one has control over!!! Kids are another thing. And it's not just toddlers Kanelli, it's kids older that should have been taught better or at least come under their parents control and not left to do as they please.

You keep telling me what I should be doing to accommodate children??? Don't sit on the aisle, don't sit near bassinettes, buy headphones, be nice to rowdy children, when a child is being fussy and wakes me up I should play with them. Is there anything else you think I should be doing to make the flight more comfortable for them???

-- Sat Jul 02, 2011 2:14 pm --

desertdudeshj wrote:Stick'em in the cargo bay.

Funny thing is that I'm getting dumped on and I didn't even make that suggestion (yet ).

You're just not as classy as I am
How ironic, going to the hospital as sis in law is about to deliver ! Gonna stick the baby in the cupboard as soon as possible, as one poster suggested !

Bah ! there goes another perfect day off, down the drain !

desertdudeshj wrote:You're just not as classy as I am
How ironic, going to the hospital as sis in law is about to deliver ! Gonna stick the baby in the cupboard as soon as possible, as one poster suggested !

Bah ! there goes another perfect day off, down the drain !

Oh, Uncle Dude!!!! Hope all goes well for her and the baby.

Thanks

Healthy baby boy, all's well with both of them.

Bloody hell, it is getting expensive to reproduce here ! Thank god for insurance !

desertdudeshj wrote:Thanks

Healthy baby boy, all's well with both of them.

Bloody hell, it is getting expensive to reproduce here ! Thank god for insurance !

Congratulations DDS! If you think the birth was expensive, wait till he grows up a bit.

desertdudeshj wrote:Thanks

Healthy baby boy, all's well with both of them.

Bloody hell, it is getting expensive to reproduce here ! Thank god for insurance !

Congrats Uncle DDS!

Hmmm...now need to buy a cupboard to put him in.

desertdudeshj wrote:Hmmm...now need to buy a cupboard to put him in.

No need to go to great expense, don't you have one under the sink?

Oh and BTW, watch Mrs DDS! She is bound to become broody whilst cooing over the new baby munchkin
Good luck.

I can't think of anything worse while travelling than travelling on business class and having a baby crying next to me or a person snoring The spanish word Ayuda (HELP) is all I can think of the whole journy.

I guess it can't be helped